Three thoughts, or parts thereof:
1. Dancers might benefit from a mention in the beginner workshops that they
should not be too surprised if the person they are to do a move with is of
the unexpected gender, that it's just done for fun and is okay. Forewarned
is forearmed. New dancers might think we're strange, but they won't have to
panic and think they've done something wrong. Maybe they'll even laugh as
they get the joke.
2. All respect to Chris Ricciotti's wonderful treatment of gender-free
calling, I still wish we could find something other than "bands and bares".
If it's the local custom, I'd wear armbands, but I really would rather just
dance the other role without worrying about whether I was dressed right.
Positional dancing really isn't all that hard, so all we really need is
better words to describe the positions. If everyone was bilingual (English
and Contra) we could use the English Country Dance terms "partner, neighbor,
and corner". Those terms pretty much define everyone in the set without
using gender. We'd just have to figure out whether we want "first corners"
to be the *"*position at the time of the call", or the "people who were
first corners when the set was formed", as in English. Either way, the pesky
"ladies chain" would simply be "second (or first ) corners chain."
3. In the meantime, however, I prefer to keep the regular terms, men (or
gents) and ladies. But I sure like the square dance terms "boy" and "girl"
because of the nice plosive consonant at the beginning of the words, making
them easy to distinguish in an echoey hall.
M
E
On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 8:57 AM, Jack Mitchell <jamitch3(a)mindspring.com>wrote:
> One other thing I had thought about doing in a workshop is to have a
> few people in each line with a red ball cap or a particular shirt or
> some other identifying mark, and challenge folks in the workshop to
> make sure that they're not swapping when they get to those particular
> people in the line. At regular dances, I have particular local dancers
> that I know don't react well to switching parts -- mostly because it
> confuses them -- and I try to switch back when I see them coming. I
> also attempt (mostly successfully) to make sure that I don't switch
> parts when one of the folks in the next couple is a new dancer. The
> partner swing is a nice time to look ahead to see who the next couple
> is and quickly switch back if needed.
> Jack
> At 09:36 AM 9/11/2009, you wrote:
>
> Following up on Mark Galipeau's note:
> In a workshop, it may be good to offer a little context on when
> gender-role-swapping is appropriate (or inappropriate). For example,
> at most
> dance weekends your neighbors will welcome or at least understand.
> At many
> monthly dances, there are neighbors who may become confused either
> because
> they are new, rigidly devoted to traditional gender roles, or any
> number of
> other reasons. Some may even try to correct us (if they don't know
> us).
> Before swapping, I look ahead in the line to be sure that our next
> neighbors
> will be part of the "game" and not put off by it.
> (Mark indicates the idea of there being a time and a place for this,
> I
> merely offer an additional tip).
> --Jerome
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 15:27:15 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: Mark Galipeau <red72impala(a)yahoo.com>
> > To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> > Subject: Re: [Callers] Gender Swapping
> > Message-ID: <964380.63567.qm(a)web83604.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
> >
> > If the group is alert, what my dance partners and I occasionally
> enjoy, is
> > memorizing both roles in the dance, then each iteration when there
> is a
> > swing your partner, we swap gender roles.
> > ie: first swing I lead, then the next time we come back to swing
> my partner
> > immediately takes the lead role and swings me.? Some dances are
> challenging
> > and if the grey matter is slow, or it is late in the evening this
> can really
> > snafu the line.
> > ?
> > Chris Ricciotti has a great web resouce on Gender Free Contra on
> this web
> > site.
> > [1]http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
> > ?
> > Mark Galipeau
> > Queer Contra Dancer
> > We swing both ways, and then some.
> >
> >
> >
> --
> Jerome Grisanti
> 660-528-0858
> [2]http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
> For the good are always the merry,
> Save by an evil chance,
> And the merry love the fiddle
> And the merry love to dance. ~ William Butler Yeats
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)sharedweight.net
> [3]http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>
> References
>
> 1. http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
> 2. http://www.jeromegrisanti.com/
> 3. http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)sharedweight.net
> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>
--
For the good are always the merry,
Save by an evil chance,
And the merry love the fiddle
And the merry love to dance. ~ William Butler Yeats
I just learned of a need for a caller and band for a Bat Mitzvah in
Washington, DC. The date and time are October 17, 7 - 11 p.m. As I
understand it, it would be pretty much of a party dance for mostly
inexperienced dancers. If anyone is interested in pursuing the matter,
please contact Renee Brachfeld <kesem(a)verizon.net> for more details.
Walter Daves
Jeff K wrote:
How did sun assembly do gender free where you didn't need to find a
partner?
At Durham, N.C. Sun Assembly dances folks sometimes just line up and someone will join you as your partner. It's also fine to ask someone specfically to dance. It's a smallish, casual group and this seems to work just fine. Not sure how it would work with a larger group.
Bree Kalb
Carrboro NC
Alan wrote:
I'm with you, and so is, eg "Heather and Rose" in Oregon and "Triangle Country
Dancers" in North Carolina. But I think that train has probably left the
station on self-consciously gender-free contra dancing.
Actually, Triangle Country Dancers, primarily a contra dance group, is not gender-free. Sun Assembly, the English group in our area, is. That's where I learned to dance and call English and it was strange the first time I danced elsewhere and had to acclimate to "Ladies" and "Men." (Even though I'd been dancing and calling contras using gendered language.) I like the more relaxed atmosphere of not needing to find a partner and no concern about gender balance.
Bree Kalb
Carrboro, NC
At 08:12 AM 9/11/2009, Martha Edwards wrote:
>1. Dancers might benefit from a mention in the beginner workshops that they
>should not be too surprised if the person they are to do a move with is of
>the unexpected gender, that it's just done for fun and is okay. Forewarned
>is forearmed. New dancers might think we're strange, but they won't have to
>panic and think they've done something wrong. Maybe they'll even laugh as
>they get the joke.
Good idea. But you might consider mentioning this to the entire
hall, rather than only to newcomers. It reminds folks that newcomers
are in the room and alerts everyone.
Hey all,
Just wanted to reiterate, for the benefit of those who may be new to the list, that our practice is to edit the subject line ourselves so that it is descriptive of the message you are posting -- instead of saying "Re: Contents of Callers digest..."
Thanks!
Mark Widmer
--- On Fri, 9/11/09, callers-request(a)sharedweight.net <callers-request(a)sharedweight.net> wrote:
From: callers-request(a)sharedweight.net <callers-request(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: Callers Digest, Vol 61, Issue 8
To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 12:00 PM
Send Callers mailing list submissions to
callers(a)sharedweight.net
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Callers digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Callers Digest, Vol 61, Issue 6 (Laur)
2. Re: Gender Swapping - When? (Robert Golder)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 08:22:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: Laur <lcpgr(a)yahoo.com>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Callers] Callers Digest, Vol 61, Issue 6
Message-ID: <312951.94148.qm(a)web52905.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Good thought.? And I liked Jack's idea of how to incorporate this in the teaching if you had time.
When partner changing, gender swapping, we should consider if the other person in the pairing is willing to dance with someone other than they said yes to.? I don't think you'd get that far in the workshop (partner swap) but it is a part of play. Sometimes at a weekend we'll have an occasional chaos line where anything goes, as I'm sure you have done/seen too.? Key for swapping is - know what your doing, and don't put an insecure or inexperienced person out there.
Locally we do as was already noted at regular, and even special dances - watch the line and switch back if someone is a bit homophobic or if it will be confusing.? Knowing your community is key.? Or get to know the community you are visiting.
The interesting thing is people don't get confused, or don't typically get confused, if its a pair of ladies dancing together, they deal with the position.? It's only when the genders are crossed that the eyes get crossed, or if its a pair of gents.? I think its a good thing to help newer folks stay familiar with the position rather than the role and rather see that than full protection from exposure.? If I see its a newer dancer when I approach another lady I say, I'm dancing as the gent as I approach, and then they are okay.? Sometimes newer male dancers ask me to twirl them or turn them so they can understand how it feels.
Laurie
--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Jerome Grisanti <jerome.grisanti(a)gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jerome Grisanti <jerome.grisanti(a)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Callers] Callers Digest, Vol 61, Issue 6
To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 9:36 AM
Following up on Mark Galipeau's note:
In a workshop, it may be good to offer a little context on when
gender-role-swapping is appropriate (or inappropriate). For example, at most
dance weekends your neighbors will welcome or at least understand. At many
monthly dances, there are neighbors who may become confused either because
they are new, rigidly devoted to traditional gender roles, or any number of
other reasons. Some may even try to correct us (if they don't know us).
Before swapping, I look ahead in the line to be sure that our next neighbors
will be part of the "game" and not put off by it.
(Mark indicates the idea of there being a time and a place for this, I
merely offer an additional tip).
--Jerome
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 15:27:15 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Mark Galipeau <red72impala(a)yahoo.com>
> To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> Subject: Re: [Callers] Gender Swapping
> Message-ID: <964380.63567.qm(a)web83604.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> If the group is alert, what my dance partners and I occasionally enjoy, is
> memorizing both roles in the dance, then each iteration when there is a
> swing your partner, we swap gender roles.
> ie: first swing I lead, then the next time we come back to swing my partner
> immediately takes the lead role and swings me.? Some dances are challenging
> and if the grey matter is slow, or it is late in the evening this can really
> snafu the line.
> ?
> Chris Ricciotti has a great web resouce on Gender Free Contra on this web
> site.
> http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
> ?
> Mark Galipeau
> Queer Contra Dancer
> We swing both ways, and then some.
>
>
>
--
Jerome Grisanti
660-528-0858
http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
For the good are always the merry,
Save by an evil chance,
And the merry love the fiddle
And the merry love to dance. ~ William Butler Yeats
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 11:43:48 -0400
From: Robert Golder <robertgolder(a)comcast.net>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Callers] Gender Swapping - When?
Message-ID: <d5867c34373f0abbe776959251f66a16(a)comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
On Sep 11, 2009, at 9:57 AM, Jack Mitchell wrote:
> One other thing I had thought about doing in a workshop is to have a
> few people in each line with a red ball cap or a particular shirt or
> some other identifying mark,
Among the several methods of identifying dance roles without respect to
gender, the most common in New England is the LCFD (Lavender Country
and Folk Dancers) method pioneered by Chris Ricciotti in 1989 at the
Jamaica Plain (MA) dance. Chris instituted the use of an armband for
the person dancing the traditional gent's role, and no armband for the
"barearm" dancer in the traditional lady's role. Orange surveyors tape
has become the most popular material for this purpose at gender role
free events. Although "bands" and "bares" are still the terms used to
denote dance roles in place of "gents" and "ladies," sometimes the
identifying mark is no longer worn on the arm. It may be a bright
headband, or a clip-on rainbow ribbon adorning a shirt pocket; still,
the meaning is clear as you approach a new couple within a contra set.
Skillful role-free calling depends upon much more than convincing half
your dancers to wear an armband. For those who are planning to
participate in a workshop or otherwise experiment with role free
calling, I can't stress highly enough the importance of going to the
LCFD site at http://www.lcfd.org/ Scroll to the "News and Articles"
section and click on "Gender-free caller's manual and history" to
download Chris Ricciotti's history of and instructions for role-free
dancing. This is the most important resource that I know of. It
includes popular contra dances written out with traditional calling
terminology and role-free terminology side by side.
Although popular within the gay and lesbian community, role-free
dancing is available to and enjoyable for everyone. NEFFA's first
programmed role-free session, using armbands, took place in 1990, and
these sessions have become a NEFFA tradition.
There are distinct advantages for callers who become fully comfortable
with dancing either role, even if you never call a specifically
role-free evening of dance. For example, as you plan an evening
program, you will find that you develop better sequences of dances to
call. As you review a dance for possible inclusion in your program,
you'll think more about how the dance choreography works for either
traditional role. After calling a dance that emphasizes the lady's
role, you'll be less likely to follow up with one or two more dances
that make the women do all the work, but will instead make sure that
the gent's role receives proper attention within the overall flow of
dance. The discovery of many more advantages awaits the caller who
looks further into this subject. ... Bob
Robert Jon Golder
New Bedford, MA
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
End of Callers Digest, Vol 61, Issue 8
**************************************
On Sep 11, 2009, at 9:57 AM, Jack Mitchell wrote:
> One other thing I had thought about doing in a workshop is to have a
> few people in each line with a red ball cap or a particular shirt or
> some other identifying mark,
Among the several methods of identifying dance roles without respect to
gender, the most common in New England is the LCFD (Lavender Country
and Folk Dancers) method pioneered by Chris Ricciotti in 1989 at the
Jamaica Plain (MA) dance. Chris instituted the use of an armband for
the person dancing the traditional gent's role, and no armband for the
"barearm" dancer in the traditional lady's role. Orange surveyors tape
has become the most popular material for this purpose at gender role
free events. Although "bands" and "bares" are still the terms used to
denote dance roles in place of "gents" and "ladies," sometimes the
identifying mark is no longer worn on the arm. It may be a bright
headband, or a clip-on rainbow ribbon adorning a shirt pocket; still,
the meaning is clear as you approach a new couple within a contra set.
Skillful role-free calling depends upon much more than convincing half
your dancers to wear an armband. For those who are planning to
participate in a workshop or otherwise experiment with role free
calling, I can't stress highly enough the importance of going to the
LCFD site at http://www.lcfd.org/ Scroll to the "News and Articles"
section and click on "Gender-free caller's manual and history" to
download Chris Ricciotti's history of and instructions for role-free
dancing. This is the most important resource that I know of. It
includes popular contra dances written out with traditional calling
terminology and role-free terminology side by side.
Although popular within the gay and lesbian community, role-free
dancing is available to and enjoyable for everyone. NEFFA's first
programmed role-free session, using armbands, took place in 1990, and
these sessions have become a NEFFA tradition.
There are distinct advantages for callers who become fully comfortable
with dancing either role, even if you never call a specifically
role-free evening of dance. For example, as you plan an evening
program, you will find that you develop better sequences of dances to
call. As you review a dance for possible inclusion in your program,
you'll think more about how the dance choreography works for either
traditional role. After calling a dance that emphasizes the lady's
role, you'll be less likely to follow up with one or two more dances
that make the women do all the work, but will instead make sure that
the gent's role receives proper attention within the overall flow of
dance. The discovery of many more advantages awaits the caller who
looks further into this subject. ... Bob
Robert Jon Golder
New Bedford, MA
Following up on Mark Galipeau's note:
In a workshop, it may be good to offer a little context on when
gender-role-swapping is appropriate (or inappropriate). For example, at most
dance weekends your neighbors will welcome or at least understand. At many
monthly dances, there are neighbors who may become confused either because
they are new, rigidly devoted to traditional gender roles, or any number of
other reasons. Some may even try to correct us (if they don't know us).
Before swapping, I look ahead in the line to be sure that our next neighbors
will be part of the "game" and not put off by it.
(Mark indicates the idea of there being a time and a place for this, I
merely offer an additional tip).
--Jerome
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 15:27:15 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Mark Galipeau <red72impala(a)yahoo.com>
> To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> Subject: Re: [Callers] Gender Swapping
> Message-ID: <964380.63567.qm(a)web83604.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> If the group is alert, what my dance partners and I occasionally enjoy, is
> memorizing both roles in the dance, then each iteration when there is a
> swing your partner, we swap gender roles.
> ie: first swing I lead, then the next time we come back to swing my partner
> immediately takes the lead role and swings me.? Some dances are challenging
> and if the grey matter is slow, or it is late in the evening this can really
> snafu the line.
> ?
> Chris Ricciotti has a great web resouce on Gender Free Contra on this web
> site.
> http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
> ?
> Mark Galipeau
> Queer Contra Dancer
> We swing both ways, and then some.
>
>
>
--
Jerome Grisanti
660-528-0858
http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
For the good are always the merry,
Save by an evil chance,
And the merry love the fiddle
And the merry love to dance. ~ William Butler Yeats
At regular public contra dances I don't switch genders. If I see a
swapped couple approaching I will often begin calling (if the caller
has stopped calling) to help my partner, and others, avoid confusion.
Greg McKenzie
*********
At 06:57 AM 9/11/2009, Jack Mitchell wrote:
> One other thing I had thought about doing in a workshop is to have a
> few people in each line with a red ball cap or a particular shirt or
> some other identifying mark, and challenge folks in the workshop to
> make sure that they're not swapping when they get to those particular
> people in the line. At regular dances, I have particular local dancers
> that I know don't react well to switching parts -- mostly because it
> confuses them -- and I try to switch back when I see them coming. I
> also attempt (mostly successfully) to make sure that I don't switch
> parts when one of the folks in the next couple is a new dancer. The
> partner swing is a nice time to look ahead to see who the next couple
> is and quickly switch back if needed.
> Jack
> At 09:36 AM 9/11/2009, you wrote:
>
> Following up on Mark Galipeau's note:
> In a workshop, it may be good to offer a little context on when
> gender-role-swapping is appropriate (or inappropriate). For example,
> at most
> dance weekends your neighbors will welcome or at least understand.
> At many
> monthly dances, there are neighbors who may become confused either
> because
> they are new, rigidly devoted to traditional gender roles, or any
> number of
> other reasons. Some may even try to correct us (if they don't know
> us).
> Before swapping, I look ahead in the line to be sure that our next
> neighbors
> will be part of the "game" and not put off by it.
> (Mark indicates the idea of there being a time and a place for this,
> I
> merely offer an additional tip).
> --Jerome
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 15:27:15 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: Mark Galipeau <red72impala(a)yahoo.com>
> > To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> > Subject: Re: [Callers] Gender Swapping
> > Message-ID: <964380.63567.qm(a)web83604.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
> >
> > If the group is alert, what my dance partners and I occasionally
> enjoy, is
> > memorizing both roles in the dance, then each iteration when there
> is a
> > swing your partner, we swap gender roles.
> > ie: first swing I lead, then the next time we come back to swing
> my partner
> > immediately takes the lead role and swings me.? Some dances are
> challenging
> > and if the grey matter is slow, or it is late in the evening this
> can really
> > snafu the line.
> > ?
> > Chris Ricciotti has a great web resouce on Gender Free Contra on
> this web
> > site.
> > [1]http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
> > ?
> > Mark Galipeau
> > Queer Contra Dancer
> > We swing both ways, and then some.
> >
> >
> >
> --
> Jerome Grisanti
> 660-528-0858
> [2]http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
> For the good are always the merry,
> Save by an evil chance,
> And the merry love the fiddle
> And the merry love to dance. ~ William Butler Yeats
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)sharedweight.net
> [3]http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>
>References
>
> 1. http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
> 2. http://www.jeromegrisanti.com/
> 3. http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>_______________________________________________
>Callers mailing list
>Callers(a)sharedweight.net
>http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
One other thing I had thought about doing in a workshop is to have a
few people in each line with a red ball cap or a particular shirt or
some other identifying mark, and challenge folks in the workshop to
make sure that they're not swapping when they get to those particular
people in the line. At regular dances, I have particular local dancers
that I know don't react well to switching parts -- mostly because it
confuses them -- and I try to switch back when I see them coming. I
also attempt (mostly successfully) to make sure that I don't switch
parts when one of the folks in the next couple is a new dancer. The
partner swing is a nice time to look ahead to see who the next couple
is and quickly switch back if needed.
Jack
At 09:36 AM 9/11/2009, you wrote:
Following up on Mark Galipeau's note:
In a workshop, it may be good to offer a little context on when
gender-role-swapping is appropriate (or inappropriate). For example,
at most
dance weekends your neighbors will welcome or at least understand.
At many
monthly dances, there are neighbors who may become confused either
because
they are new, rigidly devoted to traditional gender roles, or any
number of
other reasons. Some may even try to correct us (if they don't know
us).
Before swapping, I look ahead in the line to be sure that our next
neighbors
will be part of the "game" and not put off by it.
(Mark indicates the idea of there being a time and a place for this,
I
merely offer an additional tip).
--Jerome
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 15:27:15 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Mark Galipeau <red72impala(a)yahoo.com>
> To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> Subject: Re: [Callers] Gender Swapping
> Message-ID: <964380.63567.qm(a)web83604.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> If the group is alert, what my dance partners and I occasionally
enjoy, is
> memorizing both roles in the dance, then each iteration when there
is a
> swing your partner, we swap gender roles.
> ie: first swing I lead, then the next time we come back to swing
my partner
> immediately takes the lead role and swings me.? Some dances are
challenging
> and if the grey matter is slow, or it is late in the evening this
can really
> snafu the line.
> ?
> Chris Ricciotti has a great web resouce on Gender Free Contra on
this web
> site.
> [1]http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
> ?
> Mark Galipeau
> Queer Contra Dancer
> We swing both ways, and then some.
>
>
>
--
Jerome Grisanti
660-528-0858
[2]http://www.jeromegrisanti.com
For the good are always the merry,
Save by an evil chance,
And the merry love the fiddle
And the merry love to dance. ~ William Butler Yeats
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
[3]http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
References
1. http://www.lcfd.org/Articles/GFManual/index.html
2. http://www.jeromegrisanti.com/
3. http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
