otoh, an evening with lots of circles can be an opportunity to remind people to give weight in the circle (and slap around the people grapevining). When I do a beginners' session, I point out that a circle without weight is a really boring figure, but with weight it has some real charm. --Read Weaver Jamaica Plain, MA http://lcfd.org

Hmmm.... One of my little snippets of design understanding is that highly distinctive elements should not be used in a repeating design. So I would not program an evening with 5 dances with Petronellas, or large ovals, or contra corners. But why wouldn't it be okay to have lots of dances with swings, circles, long lines and allemandes if they help set up or unwind a distinctive move? They're so bland and common they almost shouldn't count... M E On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 5:21 PM, <95sg23(a)comcast.net> wrote: -- As you set out for Ithaka, pray that your journey be long, full of adventure, full of discovery... May there be many summer mornings when, with what pleasure, with what joy, you enter harbors you're seeing for the first time. ~Constantine Cavafy, "Ithaka" 1911

Richard wrote: dance leaders limit their use of set and turn single, or up a double and back, to only once or twice an evening. Pickiness: Allemandes qua allemandes aren't a problem; the overuse complaint was about "men allemande left once and a half" (which I suspect is usually followed by "and swing partner on the side"). According to me, figures like star, circle, allemande, swing, long lines, balance, and to a lesser extent hey, promenade, gypsy are just basic vocabulary. Nobody complains about a story that the writer used a, and, of, in, with, or various forms of "to be" too much. They like a plot, some flavor, and some variety - it shouldn't be exactly like all the other stories in the collection. (Not to mention that those basic figures are subject to modification and adjustment; they're the basis for other action. Long lines can get a roll away on the way back; stars can be hands-across and men drop out, or go once around and allemande by the hand in the star, etc, etc, etc.) I also think that what people notice (aside from the music) is large similar sequences (cl 3/4, swing on the side); gypsy meltdowns, undoing Beckets, and, more importantly, transitions. Two dances in a row whch start neighbor balance and swing will seem pretty similar (and if one finishes facing across and the next facing down in line of four, will screw up the kinetic learners so they'll face the wrong way the first few times through the second dance). While the matrix is a great tool for ensuring a variety of figures, I think it's also a good idea to pay special attention to your story lines and transitions and make sure there's a good variety. And there's nothing wrong with a bread-and-butter dance (standard figures, all the action inside the foursome), if it has good flow and a nice story line. There's a lot of variety available even if you stick to just longways contras. This also applies to programming an English evening. I would control the number of "set and turn single in place" dances, because that usually feels like filler to me, but I wouldn't have a problem with multiple things along the line of "corners set forward, turn single back to place, continue that momentum into a two-hand turn" especially if those were dances with tunes in different meters.) -- Alan -- =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON(a)SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 ===============================================================================

Ideally, a move done by one gender role should be  balanced by some move solely for the other gender role.   A ladies' chain balanced by M alm 1 1/2  in the same dance would serve this purpose.    Or consider the following A1      Balance and swing neighbor.A2      Men allemande left 1 1/2 and swing partner.B1      Long lines forward and back.  Women chain to neighbor.B2      Women allemande right (4).        1/2 hey, neighbors start passing left shoulder, until           neighbors face each other on the side they started the dance (8).        Neighbors pass left shoulders and turn sharply left to meet new           neighbors (4). On the other hand some very popular dances, such as 3-33-33 by Steve Zakon, do have a gender role imbalance.    Michael Fuerst      802 N Broadway      Urbana IL 61801       217-239-5844 Links to photos of many of my drawings and paintings are at www.ArtComesFuerst.com  --- On Mon, 2/27/12, 95sg23(a)comcast.net <95sg23(a)comcast.net> wrote: From: 95sg23(a)comcast.net <95sg23(a)comcast.net> Subject: Re: [Callers] Overused figures To: "Caller's discussion list" <callers(a)sharedweight.net> Date: Monday, February 27, 2012, 5:21 PM For me, it's from my dancing and also from a comment I heard from a dancer.  I've been to dances where men AL 1 1/2 was used 5 or more times.  The comment was from a lady who thought waiting for the men so much was  boring.  I think it's a nice move for 1 or 2 dances in an evening, 3 at the most if the rest of the choreography makes it worthwhile.  Guess I've enjoyed circles as a dancer, maybe because they weren't used that much in one program. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg McKenzie" <grekenzie(a)gmail.com> To: "Caller's discussion list" <callers(a)sharedweight.net> Sent: Monday, February 27, 2012 5:37:39 PM Subject: Re: [Callers] Overused figures What is so great about the "ProgramPlanning Matrix" is that it seems to be based upon input from a number of experienced, key people.  Nevertheless, the matrix does place a significant burden on programmers.  If you add in local preferences and personal preferences the task of programming becomes much more of a challenge.  In general this is probably a good thing. I agree that it is the variation in the transitions, the music, the dancers, and the calling styles that adds excitement to contras.  I'm not too concerned, personally, with "overused" figures.  For me it is the non-basic figures that seem to be "overused."  Keeping it simple and accessible allows greater participation which is what insures lots of variation in the people you interact with at each dance, and this--in my opinion--is the real draw of contras. If you think a figure is "overused," what is the basis of your opinion?  is it: - comments from dancers - comments from programmers - personal preference - or something else? Just wondering. - Greg McKenzie ***************** On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 10:53 AM, <Dhuntdancer(a)aol.com> wrote: _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)sharedweight.net http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)sharedweight.net http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers

This may depend upon the hemisphere the caller lives in.  :--) Michael Fuerst      802 N Broadway      Urbana IL 61801       217-239-5844 --- On Mon, 2/27/12, Liz and Bill <staf186(a)ext.canterbury.ac.nz> wrote: From: Liz and Bill <staf186(a)ext.canterbury.ac.nz> Subject: Re: [Callers] Overused figures To: "Caller's discussion list" <callers(a)sharedweight.net> Date: Monday, February 27, 2012, 10:06 PM On 28/02/2012 4:41 p.m., Michael Fuerst wrote: Hi Michael,     In my opinion, gender balance in each dance seems a bit extreme, however it does seem worth balancing gender inactivity in the evening's programming. Cheers, Bill _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)sharedweight.net http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers

David Harding wrote: I'm trying to figure out how this story works, and the only way I can see it being just as you say was if she was a man herself at the time. -- Alan -- =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON(a)SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 ===============================================================================

I had actually figured that out. I was poking mild fun at your saying she saw three times as many women as men by choosing the non-Occams-razor version of how to resolve this ambiguity; obviously you meant "three times as many men as women". Sorry to be so off-topic. I'll stop now. -- Alan -- =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON(a)SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 ===============================================================================

Hi David, Yes it's not fair, females get all the fun :-) Here's a dance for you (maybe it already exists) Let's Be Fair A1: N Bal & Sw A2: Gents Left Allemand 1 1/2; P Sw (ladies must wait 8 beats doing nothing) B1: Ladies chain over and back (so now the gents have to wait 4+4, but optionally may twirl or jig on the spot) B2: Bal the ring, Petronella roll; Bal the ring, California Twirl note: during the first 12 beats of B2 dancers can discuss whether 4+4 = 8 Cheers, Bill On 1/03/2012 4:31 p.m., David Harding wrote:

Hi, This may seem like a silly question. It concerns Rick Mohr's improper dance "Chuck the Budgie" (on his webpage and shown on a youtube video there). I thought an improper dance has the #1's facing down the hall, facing their #2's who are facing up the hall. All gents have their partners on their right side. Although the dance description says it's improper, it actually starts in a short wave which you get into by Nbr Right Allemand 3/4 to have gents in the center with left hands joined. (the last 4 beats of B2, (next nbr) Right Allemand 3/4 forms the next short wave). So this dances has a formation (consisting of short waves) with the #1's facing up the hall facing their #2's who are facing down the hall. Gents have their partners on their left. Does this have a name? Are there any other dances in this formation? Questioningly yours, Bill Chuck The Budgie Rick Mohr Improper(?) (Start: N Alle Right 3/4 to short waves with gents in the center left hands) http://youtu.be/aDBsd-ETQvE http://youtu.be/UbFX6D6ld9o A1 Gents Allemand Left 1x, Neighbor Swing A2 Circle Left 3/4, Partner Swing B1 LLFB, Ladies Allemand Right 1 1/2 (Join L hands with Nbr for short wave) B2 Balance short waves, Neighbor Allemand Left 3/4 (to long waves) Balance long waves, (new) Neighbor Allemand Right 3/4 (till men connect left hands in short waves)

Is there any benefit to *not* calling it an improper contra with a note that it starts in short waves? (The dance will tend to work better if you get people lined up, have them take hands four, and the actives cross over, so that the 1s and 2s know who they are and which way they expect to be going. *Then* have them allemand into the waves, say "the dance actually starts here", and walk the rest of it including the next progression.) -- Alan -- =============================================================================== Alan Winston --- WINSTON(a)SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: 650/926-3056 Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA 94025 ===============================================================================

Starting the walkthru for this one always feels a little weird because the gents are on the wrong side of their neighbor to start the allemande... After the allemande right 1/2 (of 3/4) the gents are facing in and the ladies are facing out, but more importantly, the lady is already on the right. So, one could argue it is in what I have called, and seen called, "progressed improper". A clearer example would be a dance where the B2 ends with swinging your new N (the one that will be current for the next time through). So you could have people swing their neighbor before starting the walkthru. Alternately, you could start the walkthru with the neighbor swing, and then walk thru almost twice and give the dancers the chance to feel that transition. Other dances in "progressed improper" formation include a dance that I'd love to ID name and author, so I might as well post it here. :-) *PRE: Swing Neighbor before first time through walkthrough and before first time through dance* A1Circle L .75 P DsD A2RH to Partner, Balance, Square thru 2 RH to Partner, Balance, Square thru 2 B1P B&S B2Circle L .75, Pass Thru New N Sw [same 4 circle L] Other thoughts? Jack On 2/27/2012 11:28 PM, Bill Baritompa wrote:

There's no official term for this. I also think of it as "progressed improper". Rick Mohr's written a number of dances like this -- for instance: Leave the Wine, My Marbles Have Many Moods, Synchronicity. These are all dances that can start proper, but after the first time default to progressed improper. (Another curiosity that starts improper and then converts to other formations is "People of the Pond" by Jim Saxe.) It's an interesting choice (all of Rick Mohr's dances could be Becketed), but I don't see problems on the dance floor when they're done, as long as dancers are reassured it's not a bug. More and more, I think not about what formation the dance is in, but what formation the dancers progress with -- whether they progress/get back into the dance improper, indecent, becket, or something else. -Chris Page San Diego p.s. The square through dance from an earlier post is a probably mistranscribed version of "Stir Crazy" by Erik Weberg. The original is Becket.

On Feb 28, 2012, at 5:51 PM, Bill Baritompa wrote: The title is actually "Person of the Pond." PERSON OF THE POND by Jim Saxe Duple contra [Notice that it doesn't say "proper" or "improper".] 1&2. Balance and swing neighbor. 3&4. Actives balance and swing. 5. Actives go down the hall and turn alone. 6. Actives come up the hall and cast off, assisted by inactives. 7. Those now in second corner positions (i.e., the right hand person in each casting pair from phrase 4) chain (by right hands, of course) to partners and roll/swap to the left. 8. Those *now* in second corner positions (i.e., the other two) chain (by right hands, of course). Notes: This is my gender-bender variant of "Lady of the Lake," composed in the latter part of 1993 and inspired by Eric Conrad's "Lord of the Lake" (see http://www.math.ohio-state.edu/~econrad/LOTL.html ). The inactives exchange sides with their partners each time through the dance. Actives may or may not exchanges sides, depending in how they end the swings in ph 3-4, and also on whether they choose to dance the alternative 5. Actives go down the hall and turn as couples. The transition from phrase 7 to phrase 8 is a fine example of a zesty transition (if zestily danced, of course). Since dancers get to experience (at least on the way up the set) both being led into the second chain and leading their partners into it, one might hope that they will start trying to give at least as good a ride as they're getting. --Jim

On Feb 29, 2012, at 12:38 PM, Bill Baritompa wrote, concerning my dance "Person of the Pond": I think of it as ending with the 1's near each other ready to balance and swing in the middle of the set. See further comments at the end of this message. When I say "second corner positions" I'm indeed using English country dance (ECD) terminology. Note that I'm referring to the persons who are *currently* in second corner positions, regardless of where they were at the start of the dance. Yes, I mean the right hand person in each casting pair from phrase 6. (That amounts to the same thing as saying "those now in second corner positions". I said it two ways in hope of minimizing the likelihood of misinterpretation.) Think about what happens in "Lady of the Lake." 1&2. Balance and swing neighbor 3&4. 1s balance and swing 5&6. 1s go down the center, turn alone, come up the center, and cast off (assisted) 7&8. W chain over and back For W1, there's a natural forward flow from the cast into the chain. For W2, there's a reversal of direction. Several generations of dancers have somehow managed to cope with this. Provided the dancers know what they're doing it's no more difficult or awkward a reversal than occurs in many other perfectly workable transitions such as "long lines go forward and back; star right." I think it may work best with 7&8 smoothed out over 16 beats. I might nonetheless prompt it the first few times as if the roll-away were ended on beat 8, lest dancers fall into the habit of starting it on beat 9. Further comments: This dance was inspired in part by reflections after I attended my first "gender-free contra" session one year at the New England Folk Festival. Since there may be some list readers who aren't familiar with these, here's how it worked: There was a supply of large orange ribbons that dancers could tie on their arms as role markers. The dances were typical contras of the time (circa 1990), but instead of directing calls to "men"/"gents" and "women"/"ladies", the caller referred to "arm bands" (dancing the traditional gent's role) and "bare arms" (dancing the traditional ladies' role). It occurred to me that it might be interesting to compose some dances that were more inherently gender-role-free and that wouldn't rely on arm-bands or on people remembering a gender role or the choreographic equivalent. In contemporary contra dancing, the choreography, including the progression, often depends on dancers ending swings with the correct dancer (whether referred to as a "lady" or as a "bare-arm") on the right. I wanted to avoid this dependency somehow, but not at the cost of excluding neighbor swings. In "Person of the Pond," the dancers don't need to remember who should end the neighbor swing on which side of their neighbor, but only to leave the 1s ready to balance and swing in the middle. For the partner swing, it doesn't matter which side you end on because the possibility of switching sides with your partner is officially part of the dance (and of course it's assumed that dancers will be happy to dance with whatever neighbors they encounter). Finally, I'd like to call attention to the timing of the B1 part (phrases 5&6). When "Lady of the Lake" is danced in the style of the late 20th and early 21st century, the neighbor swing ends with dancers in progressed position, with ladies to the right of their neighbors and gents to the left of their neighbors as they face across the set. This means that the 1s start their trip down the center after swinging below their 2s. If the timing is 5&6. 1s go down the center (6), turn alone (2), come up the center (4), and cast off (4) then the 1s have 4 steps to come up the center a bit farther than they went down in 6 steps. So dancers need to be aware of taking small steps and not going too far down the hall, lest they be rushed or late coming back up and casting off. In the mid-19th century, the "balance" would probably have been some kind of eight-beat action and the "swing" (or "turn" as it might have been called) would likely have been a two-hand turn once around, ending with dancers back where they started. Thus, the 1s would have started down the center from slightly above their 2s, making for easier timing. (I believe it was Ralph Sweet who first called my attention to this.) I don't recall where the partner swing in "Person of the Pond" has tended to happen when I've called it. (Perhaps with the 1s directly between their own 2s?) In any case, there's no need for the dancers to make a point of ending the neighbor swing in progressed position. I hope this answers Bill's questions. --Jim