I agree with Alan. Last night I realized I had three Becket type dances in the evening - but each had a different sort of transition, and very different figures within them, so they were quite distinct. I don't think dancers care whether the dances are Becket or duple minors, and it is only if transitions and patterns are highly repetitive that people will notice. And again, there was the one shared calling night where the same dance was danced in the first half and again in the second, with quite different tunes, and only a few people noticed that it was "somewhat familiar". Martha On Dec 12, 2008, at 7:39 AM, callers-request(a)sharedweight.net wrote: > Send Callers mailing list submissions to > callers(a)sharedweight.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > callers-request(a)sharedweight.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > callers-owner(a)sharedweight.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Callers digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Last call: Workshops in Gilmanton NH (gtwood(a)worldpath.net) > 2. Beckets (gtwood(a)worldpath.net) > 3. Re: Beckets (Chris Page) > 4. Re: Beckets (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing) > 5. Re: Beckets (Laur) > 6. Re: Beckets (Will Loving) > 7. Re: Beckets (Jeff Kaufman) > 8. house party squares (Jeff Kaufman) > 9. Re: house party squares (Will Loving) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 12:29:46 -0500 > From: <gtwood(a)worldpath.net> > Subject: [Callers] Last call: Workshops in Gilmanton NH > To: callers(a)sharedweight.net > Cc: musicians(a)sharedweight.net > Message-ID: <RkqyG8PE.1229016586.1070780.gtwood(a)worldpath.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > > Hi Folks, > Wanted to post one last reminder about callers and musicians > workshops In Gilmanton NH. 12/13 4:00-5:30 PM......... > pot luck dinner following the workshops > Members of SWALLOWTAIL will be conducting the workshops > > Callers: Begginer Caller and Advanced Teaching Techniques > > Musicians: Taking toons to the next level/ playing for the dance! > > Than stick around to dance to Swallowtail! > (sponcered in part by the Country Dance and Song Society) > > Details at: www.worldpath.net/~gtwood > PHONE: > 603-679-5448 > > Day of Dance > Gale: 603-817-9879 > Lynn: 603-926-9700 > > > Directions: > Gilmanton NH Town Offices > RT 107 (corner of RT 107 and RT 140) > (across from the Gilmanton Corners Store) > > Hope to see you there! > Thanks > Gale > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:20:55 -0500 > From: <gtwood(a)worldpath.net> > Subject: [Callers] Beckets > To: callers(a)sharedweight.net > Message-ID: <wLt3FyN1.1229023255.0528640.gtwood(a)worldpath.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > > Hay folks, > Typically, how many Becket dances will you call in an > evening? > I seem to be on a Becket "kick" as of late, and don't wish to > over do it. > > Thanks in advance Gale > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 16:01:26 -0800 > From: "Chris Page" <chriscpage(a)gmail.com> > Subject: Re: [Callers] Beckets > To: "Caller's discussion list" <callers(a)sharedweight.net> > Message-ID: > <9469896c0812111601k3072a06j7501d5fbcb76bfe9(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > On 12/11/08, gtwood(a)worldpath.net <gtwood(a)worldpath.net> wrote: >> >> Hay folks, >> Typically, how many Becket dances will you call in an >> evening? >> I seem to be on a Becket "kick" as of late, and don't wish to >> over do it. > > > Looking at my programs, it looks like in the last year of > 15 contra dances, I've only called 18 Becket dances. > (Last week I realized I hadn't introduced Becket when I > got to the triple minor, and needed to use that term...) > > But this isn't intentional. For me, Becket vs. Improper is > just a different way of starting the same dance. I don't > see any deep difference between them. Still, there are > a couple of factors that tilt me improper-wards: > > -When programming I seek dances that don't always > end and start the same. Most Becket dances end with > a partner swing. > > -Improper dances tend to be simpler than Becket dances, > hence more of them get done. > > (This is because an improper choreography must reach three > choreographic mileposts during the dance -- progressed, > neighbor swung, and partner swung. Becket must reach two > mileposts -- neighbor swung and partner swung; so there's > more time in the dance to wander far, far away from these > mileposts/stations.) > > (Drop the neighbor swing requirement and the above still holds.) > > -My use of other dance formations -- squares, > four-face-fours, circle mixer, triplets, and so forth -- automatically > decreases both the number of improper and Becket dances. > > -I think there's more good improper sequences out there than > Becket ones, quite possibly because that's what more > people have intentionally been trying to write. I have no data > to support this, however. > > -Chris Page > San Diego > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 15:40:47 -0800 (PST) > From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing > <winston(a)slac.stanford.edu> > Subject: Re: [Callers] Beckets > To: gtwood(a)worldpath.net > Cc: callers(a)sharedweight.net > Message-ID: <01N2Z0VAKUU4A08A4Q(a)SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii > > Gale wrote: > >> Hay folks, >> Typically, how many Becket dances will you call in an >> evening? >> I seem to be on a Becket "kick" as of late, and don't wish to >> over do it. > > I don't think dancers particularly care about Becket vs improper > per se. > They care (to some degree *) about the dances seeming too similar, but > I think what gives that impression is largely transitions (do they > all start > the same? do they all end the same?), distinctive figures (do they > all > have Rory O'Moore balance-in-lines in them?), to some degree mood > (are they > *all* slinky? are they *all* rowdy?), not whether you have them > circle left 1 > place after they take hands four. > > If you aren't boring the dancers with sameness, I don't think you have > to worry about the actual numbers. > > That said, I seem to call somewhere between 0 and 4 out of 10. > > -- Alan > > > > > -- > ====================================================================== > ========= > Alan Winston --- WINSTON(a)SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU > Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: > 650/926-3056 > Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park > CA 94025 > ====================================================================== > ========= > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 20:01:46 -0800 (PST) > From: Laur <lcpgr(a)yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: [Callers] Beckets > To: callers(a)sharedweight.net > Message-ID: <464728.92956.qm(a)web52901.mail.re2.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > > I too enjoy Becket dances.? But when I think about the why of > incorporating them in my planning a dance, its more about variety > of flow, dance moves, and level of difficulty.? I personally find > dancing a night with 6 balance? the waves or 4 Rory O'Moors, or > worse,? the combination of them, very less enjoyable, regardless of > the band, caller, or dance partner(s).? And? I try? to? remember > this in planning a program for others.? Not all Beckets are > "difficult" so I use the "easier" Beckets to vary programs when I'm > working to enhance perspective and create variety and keep the more > experienced engaged in a dance evening.?? And I use? the the more > difficult, or engaging, Beckets to challenge or enrich. > > So I enjoy Beckets, and find that sometimes I? have to "hold > back".? And I also agree with what Alan has said. > > Laurie > West Michigan/ Grand Rapids > > --- On Thu, 12/11/08, Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing > <winston(a)slac.stanford.edu> wrote: > From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing > <winston(a)slac.stanford.edu> > Subject: Re: [Callers] Beckets > To: gtwood(a)worldpath.net > Cc: callers(a)sharedweight.net > Date: Thursday, December 11, 2008, 6:40 PM > > Gale wrote: > >> Hay folks, >> Typically, how many Becket dances will you call in an >> evening? >> I seem to be on a Becket "kick" as of late, and don't wish > to >> over do it. > > I don't think dancers particularly care about Becket vs improper > per se. > They care (to some degree *) about the dances seeming too similar, but > I think what gives that impression is largely transitions (do they > all start > the same? do they all end the same?), distinctive figures (do they > all > have Rory O'Moore balance-in-lines in them?), to some degree mood > (are they > *all* slinky? are they *all* rowdy?), not whether you have them > circle left 1 > place after they take hands four. > > If you aren't boring the dancers with sameness, I don't think you have > to worry about the actual numbers. > > That said, I seem to call somewhere between 0 and 4 out of 10. > > -- Alan > > > > > -- > ====================================================================== > ========= > Alan Winston --- WINSTON(a)SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU > Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL Phone: > 650/926-3056 > Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park > CA 94025 > ====================================================================== > ========= > > _______________________________________________ > Callers mailing list > Callers(a)sharedweight.net > http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 08:17:57 -0500 > From: Will Loving <will(a)dedicationtechnologies.com> > Subject: Re: [Callers] Beckets > To: "Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>" > <callers(a)sharedweight.net> > Message-ID: <C567CEB5.2F541%will(a)dedicationtechnologies.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > On the topic of becket dances, I have a sort of minor questions: > > The majority of beckets rotate left-flowing or clockwise (CW) but an > increasing number are being written and danced which flow to the > right or > counter-clockwise (CCW). To setup for teaching a becket dance, most > callers > will simply say, "take hands four and circle one place to the left > to becket > formation" regardless of the direction of flow. > > However, for a CCW dance, some callers will give the instruction to > "take > hands four and circle one place to the right". Though this is > technically > correct with regard to the flow of the dance it seems that, at > least to the > dancers, it's not really necessary and they sometimes scratch their > heads > about "circle to the right?". > > More recently, I've noticed that as becket dances have become more > common at > least at Greenfield, MA dances (which is generally a very experienced > crowd), the instructions are simply "this is a becket formation > dance, so > stand with your partner beside you facing across the set to another > couple > and take hands four". > > Thoughts anyone? > > Will Loving > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 09:03:16 -0500 > From: cbr(a)sccs.swarthmore.edu (Jeff Kaufman) > Subject: Re: [Callers] Beckets > To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net> > Message-ID: <20081212140316.GB32046(a)sccs.swarthmore.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > On Fri, Dec 12, 2008 at 08:17:57AM -0500, Will Loving wrote: >> >> The majority of beckets rotate left-flowing or clockwise (CW) but an >> increasing number are being written and danced which flow to the >> right or counter-clockwise (CCW). To setup for teaching a becket >> dance, most callers will simply say, "take hands four and circle one >> place to the left to becket formation" regardless of the direction >> of flow. >> >> However, for a CCW dance, some callers will give the instruction to >> "take hands four and circle one place to the right". Though this is >> technically correct with regard to the flow of the dance it seems >> that, at least to the dancers, it's not really necessary and they >> sometimes scratch their heads about "circle to the right?". >> > > I should think whether to tell people to circle one place to the right > for a CCW dance would depend on how important it is to the dancers to > be going the direction they thought they would be going when they > lined up. > > In my experience, people who were dancing when there were more unequal > turn dances want to know if they are a one or a two. People who > started more recently often don't care. So what I would say would > depend on the crowd. > > > If you really want to start an argument, write an improper dance that > progresses backwards and ask people who are the ones and who are the > twos. > > Jeff >