On Jan 22, 2016, at 5:26 PM, Andy Shore via Callers &lt;callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: The Prime Minister aka The New Parliament House Jig http://www.barndances.org.uk/dance-detail.php?danceNameParam=the-new-parlia… <http://www.barndances.org.uk/dance-detail.php?danceNameParam=the-new-parliament-house-jig> https://youtu.be/wa_zj_vY-RI <https://youtu.be/wa_zj_vY-RI> I descends into the usual chaos, but lots of fun /Andy Shore Santa Cruz, CA On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 4:56 PM, Richard Fischer via Callers &lt;callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <mailto:callers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote: Can anyone suggest a 9-person dance? I'm aware of the traditional Nine-Pin, and Monkey in the Middle by Sherry Nevins. Thanks! Richard Fischer Princeton, NJ _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <mailto:Callers@lists.sharedweight.net> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net <http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net> -- /Andy Shore http://andyshore.com/ <http://andyshore.com/> best email - andyshore(a)gmail.com <mailto:andyshore@gmail.com> _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net

On Jan 23, 2016, at 7:53 AM, Tom Hinds via Callers &lt;callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: See if you can find El Capitan on line. I learned it from Larry Edelman and I believe it's Fr-CA. I probably have the dance but am to busy with the snow and critters right now to find it. T _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net

Can anyone suggest a 9-person dance? I'm aware of the traditional Nine-Pin, and Monkey in the Middle by Sherry Nevins. Thanks! Richard Fischer Princeton, NJ _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net

Under what circumstances do we have the moral and/or legal right to: 1) Call a dance written by someone else?

2) Publish a dance written by someone else?

3) Modify, or borrow from, a dance written by someone else?

Call a dance written by someone else: Pretty much always, is my guess. If I note down a dance at a festival and I like it, I call it, and try to get all attributions for announcement. Maybe if there was a caller who stipulate that no one was to call their dances without express permission or proof they’d bought the book - but I don’t know of a caller doing that.

Publish a dance written by someone else: If the dance is on the author's open website, or I know the caller personally and know they are happy to have their dances spread throughout the community, then fine. If a dance is in a book that one has to buy, then never - might mention the name and author, and maybe the book, but I wouldn’t give out the dance details. Don’t know? Don’t publish it.

Modify, borrow from, a dance written by someone else? Always! If it’s a small change and I’m calling it I just give the author credit and say it’s a slight variant (forward and back instead of circle left for example). Using an interesting figure and sticking it in a new context substantially different from the original - no problem, but I might credit the original on a website for example - “inspired by Title, by So-and-So”.

Very different from English Country, by the way. If someone has written a dance there, and you realize that a turn single left would be so much more intuitive and flow better than a turn single right, heaven forfend that you should suggest changing the author’s original intention! Even if maybe it was an oversight originally! Liberty is NOT to be taken, at least with modern dances - though it’s a little grayer with traditional dances that various people interpret differently because the original directions are sometimes obscure.

As for me - as a dance choreographer - please feel free to spread my dances - they are on my website, and I wrote them to go out into the world and be fruitful and multiply and all that.

On Jan 23, 2016, at 11:45 AM, Rich Sbardella via Callers &lt;callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: Alan wrote, "As for me - as a dance choreographer - please feel free to spread my dances - they are on my website, and I wrote them to go out into the world and be fruitful and multiply and all that." Thank you Alan for your generosity. My comments below are related to the square dance and contra dance worlds, since I am unaware of ECD norms. I wish that their was a central website that could serve as a dance swap, or dance sharing site. Any caller that wanted to make their choreo available could then easily upload the dances, and folks like me could easily download or at leat view the material. If a caller chose to keep his dances proprietary, he could make that choice as well. It would be great to be able to search for dances by title and choreography as well. As a caller that called MWSD and has migrated to contras. it was a bit of a surprise how some contra calllers commercially published dance choreography for a particular set of dances. In MWSD, 64 step dances are quite the norm for singing calls, and many callers have developed quite interesting figures. Several callers have published compilations of singing call figures without crediting thei original choreographers. If I danced a figure, and I enjoyed it, it was perfectly acceptable to use that figure in a different singing call., in fact it was encouraged. I often searched websites, not necessarily for music to buy, but rather for dance figures. In the contra world, I have met callers very liberal with their dances, and they will freely provide choreography. Some are honored, or even flattered, when another caller calls their dance. Other callers are more protective of their choreography, for what ever reason. They may sell that choreography in booklet or recorded form. That is certainly within their rights. I have purchased many such booklets. However, when I go to a dance as a dancer, I am looking for smooth and/or interesting choreography to add to my collection of dances. I may take notes on several dances, but I seldom use more that one or two dances that I pick up on any given evening. I am guessing that this is ethical. Last weekend, I danced to a caller that was new to me. He has written many dances and I especially enjoyed two of the ones he called. When I emailed him about the dances, he sent me the requested choreography, along with a few others he wrote. He was more generous than I hoped for. I also have a basement full of dance books, records and CDs by many callers and bands. When it is available, I often take advantage of the opportunity to purchase material as a way to support artists. I also find much choreography on line. Youtube is a valuable resource. There are many other resources as well. Many callers have websites with their dances published for the free use of others. My cards always indicate the author of the dance, or the source, if I do not know the author, and I most often announce the author when I call dance. The concept that someone own's choreography is difficult for me to understand, since most dances incorporate elements of previous dances, or moves borrowed from someone, or somewhere. I understand that choreographers can innovate as they write dances, but really are not most, or maybe all, dances really just variations of others, either in part or in whole? Rich Stafford, CT On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 10:42 PM, Winston, Alan P. via Callers &lt;callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <mailto:callers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote: On 1/22/2016 7:02 PM, Martha Wild via Callers wrote: Call a dance written by someone else: Pretty much always, is my guess. If I note down a dance at a festival and I like it, I call it, and try to get all attributions for announcement. Maybe if there was a caller who stipulate that no one was to call their dances without express permission or proof they’d bought the book - but I don’t know of a caller doing that. Agreed! Publish a dance written by someone else: If the dance is on the author's open website, or I know the caller personally and know they are happy to have their dances spread throughout the community, then fine. If a dance is in a book that one has to buy, then never - might mention the name and author, and maybe the book, but I wouldn’t give out the dance details. Don’t know? Don’t publish it. I assume you're using "publish" to mean "disseminate" - give out the instructions on mailing lists, let people see your card, whatever. If so, agreed! To be excessively anal about it, I would disagree if "publish" meant "include in a collection I was putting out to sell" (without getting express permission from the author.) Modify, borrow from, a dance written by someone else? Always! If it’s a small change and I’m calling it I just give the author credit and say it’s a slight variant (forward and back instead of circle left for example). Using an interesting figure and sticking it in a new context substantially different from the original - no problem, but I might credit the original on a website for example - “inspired by Title, by So-and-So”. Agreed. And sometimes the name of the new dance can have a nod to the name of the old dance. Very different from English Country, by the way. If someone has written a dance there, and you realize that a turn single left would be so much more intuitive and flow better than a turn single right, heaven forfend that you should suggest changing the author’s original intention! Even if maybe it was an oversight originally! Liberty is NOT to be taken, at least with modern dances - though it’s a little grayer with traditional dances that various people interpret differently because the original directions are sometimes obscure. Not *always*. I have seen respected ECD leaders call things differently than they were written, although they usually call attention to it when doing it. I have also had someone ask me if a particular modification of a dance I'd written - a right-hand turn instead of a g-word - was acceptable to me, and I said "sure", and wasn't honked that he called it that way. I was pleased when he put it on the program of a ball he was calling, and then honked when the ball booklet had the modified version and listed the dance as a collaboration between the two of us. As for me - as a dance choreographer - please feel free to spread my dances - they are on my website, and I wrote them to go out into the world and be fruitful and multiply and all that. Thanks for that! I've called some of them and been happy to have them. -- Alan _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <mailto:Callers@lists.sharedweight.net> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net <http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net> _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net

My understanding is that here in the US choreography can't be protected by law but the written word or the description of it can be legally copyrighted. It would be interesting to know what the law is in the UK.

On Jan 25, 2016, at 4:11 AM, Neal Schlein via Callers &lt;callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: Since the original question had two points, about legal and moral standing, I'll answer the legal part: The short answer is NO YOU MAY NOT WITHOUT PERMISSION. US law is both extremely clear and exceptionally vague. The clear parts: 1. Any new creative work that is set down in a fixed form is instantly copyrighted. There is a bare minimum of creativity needed to generate copyrightable material. 2. Dance choreography is a copyrightable form. 3. The following acts are SOLELY allowed to the copyright holder or specifically licensed user: performance, reproduction, reprinting, publishing, public display, broadcast, recording, creation of a derivative work. I may have forgotten a few. 4. US copyright law has no moral requirements; it is purely financial and transactional in nature. You have no legal moral requirement (whatever that means...) to acknowledge the author's wishes or even identify them as the author. In Europe this is different. 5. There is no mechanism established in US copyright law for a person to place an item into the public domain, nor for unclaimed and otherwise orphan works except if they clearly fall into the public domain due to age. See Creative Commons for an attempted fix. 6. If an item is not registered with the Copyright Office, you can only sue for actual damages and demand cessation. (Usually neither worth it nor desired in our world.) If an item has been registered with the Copyright Office, you can sue for many thousands of dollars, plus court costs and actual damages. 7. There are no provisions for traditional or folk material or forms, and very little case law. So, all modern contra dances are copyrighted works, and under the main part of the law it is clear that you may not legally publish, reprint, call (perform), or video tape them without permission from the copyright holder (this is not necessarily the author). The unclear part: The Fair Use provision allows for anyone to use copyrighted material without permission in any of the otherwise prohibited ways...under unspecified circumstances, according to at least four criteria that must be applied to each individual situation and weighted uniquely by a judge, and which can only be determined with certainty for a given case by the Supreme Court. So, basically useless as a planning guide. Whether you think the above should be true or not, it is correct based on the law. Feel free to ask questions. I actually enjoy this stuff. Neal Neal Schlein Youth Services Librarian, Mahomet Public Library Currently reading: The Different Girl by Gordon Dahlquist Currently learning: How to set up an automated email system. On Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 2:54 PM, Colin Hume via Callers &lt;callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <mailto:callers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote: On Sat, 23 Jan 2016 10:47:04 -0500, Tom Hinds via Callers wrote: My understanding is that it's the same here. But when we've discussed copyright on lists the usual conclusion is that there just isn't enough money in it for anyone to make a fuss no matter what happens! Colin Hume

Since the original question had two points, about legal and moral standing, I'll answer the legal part: The short answer is NO YOU MAY NOT WITHOUT PERMISSION. US law is both extremely clear and exceptionally vague. The clear parts: 1. Any new creative work that is set down in a fixed form is instantly copyrighted. There is a bare minimum of creativity needed to generate copyrightable material. 2. Dance choreography is a copyrightable form. 3. The following acts are SOLELY allowed to the copyright holder or specifically licensed user: performance, reproduction, reprinting, publishing, public display, broadcast, recording, creation of a derivative work. I may have forgotten a few. 4. US copyright law has no moral requirements; it is purely financial and transactional in nature. You have no legal moral requirement (whatever that means...) to acknowledge the author's wishes or even identify them as the author. In Europe this is different. 5. There is no mechanism established in US copyright law for a person to place an item into the public domain, nor for unclaimed and otherwise orphan works except if they clearly fall into the public domain due to age. See Creative Commons for an attempted fix. 6. If an item is not registered with the Copyright Office, you can only sue for actual damages and demand cessation. (Usually neither worth it nor desired in our world.) If an item has been registered with the Copyright Office, you can sue for many thousands of dollars, plus court costs and actual damages. 7. There are no provisions for traditional or folk material or forms, and very little case law. So, all modern contra dances are copyrighted works, and under the main part of the law it is clear that you may not legally publish, reprint, call (perform), or video tape them without permission from the copyright holder (this is not necessarily the author). The unclear part: The Fair Use provision allows for anyone to use copyrighted material without permission in any of the otherwise prohibited ways...under unspecified circumstances, according to at least four criteria that must be applied to each individual situation and weighted uniquely by a judge, and which can only be determined with certainty for a given case by the Supreme Court. So, basically useless as a planning guide. *Whether you think the above should be true or not, it is correct based on the law*. Feel free to ask questions. I actually enjoy this stuff. Neal Neal Schlein Youth Services Librarian, Mahomet Public Library Currently reading: *The Different Girl* by Gordon Dahlquist Currently learning: How to set up an automated email system. On Sat, Jan 23, 2016 at 2:54 PM, Colin Hume via Callers < callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net