11 Feb
2014
11 Feb
'14
5:29 p.m.
Personally I prefer that the "regular dancers" do not verbally "teach"
the new dancers. Contrary to what you've described I find that
what I have learned to say succinctly and clearly during my years of calling
will take a "regular dancer" 2 or 3x the amount of time to say and by that time
the new dancer is late for the next move
AND has learned not to listen to the caller.
Please consider that some "regular dancers" who are dancing with beginners are
trying to impress them with their knowledge rather than assisting
the new dancers to learn quickly and correctly.
I agree that taking "a second to mention" (as John suggested) tricky timing or
the execution of a move "Ladies Chain: Ladies give right hands pull by
give your left to the gent for a courtesy turn" takes no more time to explain than
it takes the dancers to walk it through.
Of course this much detail is for the first and possibly second Ladies Chain of the
evening and NOT every time.
I prefer that the "regulars" teach by example and "show" by action as
I explain with words.
I do not endorse "A caller who jabbers constantly" (as you wrote)... but to
"drip-feed good ideas" (as John suggested)
throughout the evening, taking a few seconds here and a few seconds, I believe, will help
create a more cohesive dance experience
for all on the floor.
Donna Hunt
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg McKenzie <grekenzie(a)gmail.com>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Sent: Tue, Feb 11, 2014 4:56 pm
Subject: Re: [Callers] Circle & pass through as the last move of a dance
John wrote:
Read also mentioned "avoidance of teaching".
But we ARE teachers. You may CALL it a walk-through, but what you are
actually doing is TEACHING the dance. And if the dance will work better if
you point out some key items then go head and point them out, i.e. teach!
I know that many of us love teaching. In fact it seems to be one reason
many take up calling in the first place. But teaching from the mike at an
open, public contra dance can be very counterproductive...particularly with
regard to your efforts to integrate first-timers into the fun.
You love to teach. But so do most of the regular dancers. A big part of
the fun of partnering with newcomers is being able to guide them through
the dance and share your passion for this wonderful dance form. While the
caller is teaching verbally it is almost impossible for the regulars to
enjoy their own "teaching" role. If you really want the regulars to
partner with first-timers one of the key "tricks" is to make sure the
regulars will have time to take the lead and "teach" their partner during
the walk through.
This is what makes partnering with regulars fun, And that is why I try to
keep my prompts to an absolute minimum during the walk-through.
A caller who jabbers constantly during the walk-through can transform the
joy of a collaborative learning experience into a dreadful chore as the
regulars are required to stand by silently while the caller *explains *a
move that they could *show *their partner in less time than it would take
the caller to say the *name *of the move.
And later the caller will complain that it is so hard to get the regulars
to partner with first-timers.
Instead of "explaining" that a circle takes only "6 counts" I would
gently
suggest that callers consider simply giving the prompt "pass through" so
that it ends precisely two counts before the end of the phrase.
That way you can "say it all" with only two words and the dancers get to
keep moving in time with the live music. Make it fun!
Just a thought.
Greg McKenzie
West Coast, USA
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
11 Feb
11 Feb
6:09 p.m.
New subject: Circle & pass through as the last move of a dance
Donna wrote:
Personally I prefer that the "regular
dancers" do not verbally "teach" the
new dancers.
I agree wholeheartedly and would not suggest that the regulars speak at all
during a walk-through.
The only exception to that might be when a caller is doing such a poor job
that confusion is spreading wildly through the hall. Sometimes it is
necessary to clarify something when the caller makes a serious error and
does not realize it. Otherwise some dancers may think that the confusion
is *their *fault. That would be bad.
The vast majority of the teaching that takes place in the dance hall is
non-verbal. As the only person in the hall with a microphone it is very
important that the caller realize that fact. Talking on mike is often much
more disruptive than talking in the dance line.
- Greg McKenzie
West Coast, USA
7:12 p.m.
New subject: Circle & pass through as the last move of a dance
I agree that the caller trying to teach too much verbally gets pointless
very quickly. There are definitely pointers that callers can give that will
help dancers a bunch, but they should be given quickly and succinctly,
and/or shown through demonstration ("try the allemande the angry,
competitive way! Now try a noodle-arm allemande. Okay, now try it a way
that feels better to both of you.") It's distressingly easy for a caller to
make him/herself tune-out-able.
Along the lines of what Jonathan said, I'd be wary of even bringing up
"beats" to dancers at all. A lot of dancers aren't necessarily even
familiar with that terminology, or at least don't think of dancing in terms
of beats/phrase length, so to make a passing mention to the number of beats
something takes may be MORE confusing than not mentioning it all. Instead,
I would go with something like "the circle left is faster than you think!"
or "make sure you pass through in time to balance your next neighbor!" (and
then be really precise with calling the balance so it lines up directly
with the big beat--dancers on the whole tend to FEEL the beat 10x better
than they intellectually understand it).
On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 6:09 PM, Greg McKenzie <grekenzie(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Donna wrote:
Personally I prefer that the "regular
dancers" do not verbally "teach"
the
new dancers.
I agree wholeheartedly and would not suggest that the regulars speak at all
during a walk-through.
The only exception to that might be when a caller is doing such a poor job
that confusion is spreading wildly through the hall. Sometimes it is
necessary to clarify something when the caller makes a serious error and
does not realize it. Otherwise some dancers may think that the confusion
is *their *fault. That would be bad.
The vast majority of the teaching that takes place in the dance hall is
non-verbal. As the only person in the hall with a microphone it is very
important that the caller realize that fact. Talking on mike is often much
more disruptive than talking in the dance line.
- Greg McKenzie
West Coast, USA
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
12 Feb
12 Feb
4:44 a.m.
New subject: Circle Left, Pass Though, Timing, & Teaching...
It is interesting to read all these comments on circling, teaching, and
timing.
When I first started contra dancing, in 1980, it was extremely common,
in my neck of the woods (California, more specifically, Santa Barbara),
for the caller to take a few moments once or twice during the course of
the dance to teach a styling point. At that time, we dancers honored and
listened and learned. I don't know when it got to the point where a
caller stopped being enough of an "expert" to no longer get that
respect. Perhaps it was about the same time squares went out of fashion,
and only smooth, equal contras became the norm.
It's interesting to think that, when we did unequal dances, and triple
minors, and squares, and there was a wider variety of dances at the
contras I went to, there was a lot more to learn, and needing the
expertise of the teacher was greater. Now, though, as many have pointed
out, some points of style have gotten lost -- and just letting
"experienced" dancers do the teaching is not bringing these points back.
Let's take this item that's been discussed Circle left 3/4 and pass through.
Well, let's start with allemande: I learned from my caller/teacher (in
the course of regular evening dances...) that one could adjust the
timing of an allemande by getting closer or farther from your allemande
partner. We did dances that required once around in 8 beats. No problem:
let your arms unbend a bit, give good weight, and it's a joyous
connection. Need to get around 1-1/2 in 8 beats? No Problem, bend arms a
bit more and it's easy. Twice around in 8, as in Hull's Victory? Easy --
and Rollickin'! -- just make it close.
Same is true of circles. There are dances where it's all the way around
in 8, then 3/4ths around in 8. Change the timing by the circumference of
the circle. Do we teach this? No. And there are times when it's 3/4ths
around in 6, and pass through for 2. It's easy if we give weight in a
circle and make the adjustment to the diameter. But it's rarely pointed
out. As a matter of fact, weight in circles is actually very rare these
days, and that gratifying sense of connection has gone under some rock
somewhere. And this does not get taught from the floor. Not sure what to
do because:
If one does take a couple minutes to make a particular styling point,
many "experienced dancers" don't listen, or worse, act like the teacher
is saying something stupid and dramatically do the opposite of the
suggestion. I've had this happen to me. So, this is a long diatribe of
not sure what we should do, but I think thinking about how to present
styling -- especially when it comes to safety -- no gripping, smooth
connection, symmetrical allemandes, etc. is important -- and not
effectively taught from the floor unless you know all your helpers are
on the same page.
erik hoffman
oakland, ca
On 2/11/2014 4:12 PM, Maia McCormick wrote:
I agree that the caller trying to teach too much
verbally gets pointless
very quickly. There are definitely pointers that callers can give that will
help dancers a bunch, but they should be given quickly and succinctly,
and/or shown through demonstration ("try the allemande the angry,
competitive way! Now try a noodle-arm allemande. Okay, now try it a way
that feels better to both of you.") It's distressingly easy for a caller to
make him/herself tune-out-able.
Along the lines of what Jonathan said, I'd be wary of even bringing up
"beats" to dancers at all. A lot of dancers aren't necessarily even
familiar with that terminology, or at least don't think of dancing in terms
of beats/phrase length, so to make a passing mention to the number of beats
something takes may be MORE confusing than not mentioning it all. Instead,
I would go with something like "the circle left is faster than you think!"
or "make sure you pass through in time to balance your next neighbor!" (and
then be really precise with calling the balance so it lines up directly
with the big beat--dancers on the whole tend to FEEL the beat 10x better
than they intellectually understand it).
On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 6:09 PM, Greg McKenzie <grekenzie(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Donna wrote:
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
Personally I prefer that the "regular
dancers" do not verbally "teach"
the
new dancers.
I agree wholeheartedly and would not suggest that the regulars speak at all
during a walk-through.
The only exception to that might be when a caller is doing such a poor job
that confusion is spreading wildly through the hall. Sometimes it is
necessary to clarify something when the caller makes a serious error and
does not realize it. Otherwise some dancers may think that the confusion
is *their *fault. That would be bad.
The vast majority of the teaching that takes place in the dance hall is
non-verbal. As the only person in the hall with a microphone it is very
important that the caller realize that fact. Talking on mike is often much
more disruptive than talking in the dance line.
- Greg McKenzie
West Coast, USA
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
3966
days inactive
3967
days old
contracallers@lists.sharedweight.net
3 comments
4 participants
participants (4)
-
Donna Hunt -
Erik Hoffman -
Greg McKenzie -
Maia McCormick