[Callers] Re: Gentlespoons/Ladles (from Rompin' Stompin')

I don’t recall when I turned the Berkeley dance into a series that used non-gendered terms, but we accepted it was early in the rage. Prior to hearing about using these terms I used Men and Women. I didn’t use ladies and gents as I didn’t want to use terms that were historically class based. A dancer caught me in a private moment and after asking me why told me for him and friends men and women were seen as a gender, ladies and gents were roles, thus more comfortable to hear. I switched back to ladies and gents, realizing they had lost much of the class meaning. When I searching for non-gendered terms I found a list, a survey of non-gendered terms being used. I think from it came from Amherst College. The ones I remember were Jets & Rubies. “Jets,” I thought? Uh, “When you’re a Jet, You’re a Jet?” Or is it a Jet spewing contrails? No. A jet is a gem stone. Never knew that. Jets and Rubies didn’t work for me. Then there were Trees and Squirrels. I like that one. Used them for a couple months. Too lighthearted. Finally landed on Larks and Ravens. Lasted a couple years until Ravens lost favor and we went to Larks and Robins. I am glad it seems Larks and Robins are becoming the standard. When working in elementary schools, for years I used Red Birds and Blue Birds, so Larks and Robins fit quite well. I still use Gents and Ladies in communities that prefer those terms. Cheers, ~Erik Hoffman Oakland, CA *From:* Gabrielle Taylor via Contra Callers < contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; *Sent:* Thursday, February 9, 2023 5:57 AM *To:* Jim Thaxter &lt;jathaxter47(a)gmail.com&gt; *Cc:* Peghesley &lt;peghesley(a)cox.net&gt;et>; Shared Weight Contra Callers < contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; *Subject:* [Callers] Re: Gentlespoons/Ladles (from Rompin' Stompin') As a member of the LGBT community, my view (personal, from talking to others, and from votes in local contra dances in Western Massachusetts) is it's very good to have a consistent term that isn't inherently gendered. After local debate and dance-specific polls, we've been using larks and robins/ravens here since about 2018, and I think it's been a big improvement over ladies/gents. Larks and robins are my personal preference, since it's what everyone here is used to, and I at least don't have enough bird knowledge to get confused about robins or larks having some inherent gendering. I don't have any cultural stance against positional calling, but the confusion of "lefts allemande right" seems a lot worse than learning new terms. Thanks, Gabrielle On Feb 9, 2023, at 13:45, Jim Thaxter via Contra Callers < contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: Just a thought, but has anyone checked with the lgbtq community about what terms they would like to have used? Another thought, someone mentioned earlier in the thread that the terminology issue had been discussed thoroughly some time ago and the decision had been made to go with the birds. I don’t remember seeing or hearing about a general survey sent out to all the CDSS affiliates or any other general list of dance groups around the country or world vetting that decision Personally, I’m exploring positional calling. Just my gut feeling, but I think fewer people would be challenged by right/left directional calls than by being called bird names. Jim Thaxter Columbia, MO On Thu, Feb 9, 2023 at 6:31 AM Amy Cann via Contra Callers < contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: Since no one else has mentioned this, I'll just say that my entire personal difficulty with birds comes from fairy tales and ornithology. When we say "robin" we are mostly thinking about that bird with the "red breast", right? Not something kinda reddish-brownish? That's the male. In my childhood I read any number of books with anthropomorphised birds, and Mister Robin Redbreast was male. In a bunch of the stories there was also small, sweet-singing female lark. Add to that that in the states the robin is a different bird from in the UK, and much larger, I've got two good reasons to think of the robin as being the "male" role. My brain weighs the imagery and memories against that silly little detail of starting with "R" or "L" and defaults obstinately to the exact wrong conclusion every time. EVERY time. It's somewhat maddening. But "Ravens" was even worse, because ravens are black and men in formal clothing dress in black, so I guess things are better now?? Whew. Change is hard. On 2/9/23, Peghesley via Contra Callers &lt;contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote: reference to in female time terms role. contra who be using (rather early the “men/women,” other an contracallers-leave(a)lists.sharedweight.net _______________________________________________ Contra Callers mailing list -- contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net To unsubscribe send an email to contracallers-leave(a)lists.sharedweight.net _______________________________________________ Contra Callers mailing list -- contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net To unsubscribe send an email to contracallers-leave(a)lists.sharedweight.net _______________________________________________ Contra Callers mailing list -- contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net To unsubscribe send an email to contracallers-leave(a)lists.sharedweight.net