[Callers] Re: Advanced dances gone awry

Hi all, I agree with Julian completely. Asking someone to leave an "advanced dance" (or any dance) because they aren't "advanced" enough is so totally wrong. First of all you are asking folks to "self-assign" their level in the first place, so, really, you're going to "get what you get" and kicking someone out after they, possibly, screw up the courage to try it, is just wrong. I am reminded of the dance medleys at NEFFA and other dance festivals. NO ONE doesn't want to join the dance medley. For many it's the most important dance of the weekend. yeah we make all these rules, sometimes in "verse" (hi Lisa - I know you are listening), but bottom line is always that very inexperienced dancers join. For the most part they get absorbed without a problem and I think a dance full of "experienced dancers" should be able to guide these folks through the dance when they meet up without decreasing their own enjoyment. That's my experience anyway. The alternative is requiring certain "credentials" to join the dance as in what I assume is the norm for club square dancing. I think that is what we are trying to avoid in contra dancing, right? We make a big deal of the fact that all are welcome. OK, yeah, we advertise an 'advanced dance' BUT unless you have some sort of ridiculous screening at the door you're still going to get dancers of all levels. These folks should be WELCOMED not sent away. It's not like I don't get the problem here. How do we "elevate the dance level in our local communities"? That's a tough one but I think the organizers need to make it really clear what the complexity will be. This will be somewhat successful, but we all know many folks don't "read the fine print" (or heck even the bold print!). Maybe they are new to contradancing, are excited about it, see there's a dance, and just go. I think if a dance is advertised as "advanced level" and a number of beginners show up to an extent that actually "degrades" the dance, then the organizers are reading their community incorrectly. So, let's say this happens and the "experienced dancers" have an expectation that is not met? Well boo hoo, let's suck it up and spend some of our time as "an experienced dancer" helping the new folks along!!! THEN organizers reevaluate everything. Maybe an "invitation only" event? Maybe just be content with the fact that intermediate level is just fine as long as you're attracting new dancers. Callers can always throw in a few tricky dances at appropriate times to "push the envelope" a bit. And of course there's always dance weekends for the really "advanced" folks. So this is a callers list, not an organizer's list.. sooooo... what do I have to say to callers? This goes for any dance, not just an "advanced" dance (I've been calling for almost 40 years and have never called something advertised as an "advanced dance", except previously mentioned dance medleys) (yeah I know, maybe I don't get out that much any more hah hah). Callers, don't be afraid to push the level beyond the comfort level of many of the dancers! I am often afraid to do this myself. One set falls apart, but the other lines "get it". For the most part the "fall apart" set is grinning and having fun anyway!! This is almost always a good thing, even if it makes you feel you screwed up.. Finally, to what Julian said, I don't think anyone needs to get in free. A contra dance even if you're just sitting and listening to the music is one of the best entertainment values on the planet (3 hours of live trad music for 10 bucks heck maybe snacks at the break). yeah OK, maybe "donation".. but still.. this is a good deal. I think I might have more to say here, but I'll leave it at this and see what blows back. peace everyone bill ________________________________ From: Julian Blechner via Contra Callers &lt;contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; Sent: Monday, April 17, 2023 4:57 PM To: Maia McCormick &lt;maia.mcc(a)gmail.com&gt; Cc: Shared Weight Contra Callers &lt;contracallers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; Subject: [Callers] Re: Advanced dances gone awry I've given this some thought. I've been a dancer in this situation, and heard other organizers ask this question. I don't like the idea of asking someone to leave. I do think this is antithetical to my values as a dance organizer. I don't like the idea of gatekeeping and presuming I know how well a person may succeed not - especially since contra is a team sport. I also want to raise the idea of economic injustice - many folks carpool, or, in NYC it may be a pain to get to a location - even by mass transit a new person could really need the help of a friend. Especially if it's a person from out of town; having lived in and around NYC for a decade, it can be _daunting_. So I can totally see some experienced dancers wanting to bring a friend, and having them come later is not an option. Forcing them to come later may be easier for folks with financial means, which is why I'm saying this may touch on an issue of economic justice and privilege. An alternative I might have - and, totally with the benefit of hindsight and reflection: I think if I'm in this situation in the future, I will do the following: 1. Caution the dancer of the expected skill level. 2. Offer them to sit and enjoy the music for free / donation instead of required entry fee. 3. Recommend that if they're set on trying it out, to do so, but if they're not getting it, come hang out and stay, with fee refunded. (Like a satisfaction guarantee.) Ideally, if they do stay and sit, some dancers will need breaks and sit with them and make them feel welcome. In dance, Julian Blechner On Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 9:50 PM Maia McCormick via Contra Callers <contracallers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:contracallers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote: I attended an advanced dance this afternoon that was intermediate at best, and had a few raw beginners in there, and it got me wondering: 1. As callers, what do you do when a bunch of intermediate and/or beginner dancers show up to an advanced session? 2. As organizers, what do you do to try and keep your advanced sessions... advanced? (Either in messaging or at the dance itself?) Obviously I'm not advocating for kicking anyone out, but if a bunch of newbies show up at an advanced session, both they and the dancers who came for gnarly stuff are going to have a less-than-ideal time. 3. As dancers (/organizers/callers), how do we elevate the dance level of our local communities? I'm talking about increasing familiarity with some of the less common moves (contracorners, left hand chains, etc.) but also about building awareness of the dance and recovery skills, and technical things like giving satisfying weight, swinging correctly, guiding linemates into the next figure, etc. I welcome any thoughts and musings! Cheers, Maia (Brooklyn, NY) -- Maia McCormick (she/her) 917.279.8194 _______________________________________________ Contra Callers mailing list -- contracallers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:contracallers@lists.sharedweight.net> To unsubscribe send an email to contracallers-leave@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:contracallers-leave@lists.sharedweight.net>