10 Sep
2015
10 Sep
'15
6:14 p.m.
Great point, thanks Lisa.
On Thursday, September 10, 2015, Lisa Greenleaf via Callers <
callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Hi Everyone-
I am cringing every time I read the word victim. VIctim implies
powerlessness, so why not use the word dancer and encourage
self-empowerment?
Sometimes dancers approach me because I am an official organizer, and
other times friends of the person approach me because they know I might be
able to help. My first question around complaints is always, “Did you talk
with the person whose behavior bothered you?” And then I model an “I”
statement for them: “I don’t like that,” “I don’t feel comfortable dancing
with you because I don’t like to be twirled,” etc.
Of course, most people find it difficult to talk directly to the person
disturbing them, but it’s still worth encouraging, especially if you show
them how to do it. You are teaching them a real-world skill that they can
use outside of the dance.
When a dancer approaches me with a complaint, I don’t see them as a victim
who needs rescuing. For one thing, I don’t know the real situation until
I have heard both sides of the story. Yes, the situation may expand to a
larger problem, but even then I don’t change “dancer” (or more
specifically, the name of the person) to “victim.”
Lisa
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>
http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
Lisa
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>
http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
--
--------------------
Lindsay Morris
CEO, TSMworks
Tel. 1-859-539-9900
lindsay(a)tsmworks.com
On Sep 9, 2015, at 8:02 PM, Yoyo Zhou via Callers
<
callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>> wrote:
Taking you at face value: if you have a systemic problem, you need a
policy. If you have a problem with one person, you need to come to
terms with that person. I'm not sure if it's just the board, or if
other dancers also have issues with her. But if you seek mediation,
take notes on your interactions so you have evidence to back yourself
up.
Now, I think the last thing you need is a policy requiring victims to
speak up. It's counterproductive to making a safe dance space. (Let's
discuss that on the other thread.)
Let's say I'm new to your dance and I have a bad experience with
someone. What do I do? I might complain about it to my friends who
convinced me to come. I might just avoid that person. I might just go
home dissatisfied. One of the last things I might do is complain to
the management (and I might view that woman as an extension thereof),
because who knows if they'll just shrug it off and not take me
seriously?
Also, you wrote, "it seems to me that she's committing violence." No,
I disagree. This totally cheapens the meaning of "violence". What
words do you use for when punches are actually thrown? (It's happened
at a dance here.)
Yoyo Zhou
On Wed, Sep 9, 2015 at 7:42 AM, Ron Blechner via Callers
<callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>> wrote:
> Maybe. Maybe not. My point was that we should be very, very careful
about
> making a definitive statement about something
being "just an
accusation",
> especially when in your example, there was a
second problem - even if
it was
> a year earlier.
>
> On Sep 9, 2015 10:39 AM, "Lindsay Morris via Callers"
> <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>
>> Appreciate that. Don't think the "where there's smoke there's
fire"
issue
>> applies here, though. It would if there
were several different women
>> complaining about one man...
>>
>> --------------------
>> Lindsay Morris
>> CEO, TSMworks
>> Tel. 1-859-539-9900
>> lindsay(a)tsmworks.com <javascript:;>
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2015 at 10:34 AM, Ron Blechner <contraron(a)gmail.com
<javascript:;>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Lindsay,
>>>
>>> I realize this is a tricky topic, so apologies in advance if my
brevity
>>> comes off as bruskness.
>>>
>>> These two suggestions work for Amherst Contra.
>>>
>>> As a proxy complaint comes in, a board member would seek out the
source.
>>> Anonymous complaints are permitted,
and a high level of ensuring that
we ask
>>> open-ended questions, and not leading
questions.
>>>
>>> We also wear board member buttons at dances and make regular
>>> announcements about us being available for any reason. Usually 4-7
members
>>> of our board attend any dance.
>>>
>>> You might speak privately to Will Loving, our lead organizer, if
you're
>>> interested in more specifics.
>>>
>>> I would also caution about making such definitive statements as "just
an
>>> accusation". In my experience,
where there's smoke, there's fire. For
every
>>> accusation, there's five people
who are too uncomfortable to speak up.
>>>
>>> That said, I have seen the success of proactive addressing of issues.
The
>>> biggest benefit is simple:
>>>
>>> Address it early when it's small, and not a huge deal. Maybe it's a
>>> simple misunderstanding. Maybe the person needed a clear boundary
drawn. But
>>> wait until there's a pile of
complaints, and you've already lost
dancers and
>>> the resolution will need to be more
severe for the offender.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> Ron Blechner
>>>
>>> On Sep 9, 2015 10:08 AM, "Lindsay Morris via Callers"
>>> <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Chris Weiler's Positive Solutions on dealing with problem dancers,
and
>>>> the CDU Policy are thoughtful and
useful documents.
>>>>
>>>> We have a different problem here.
>>>>
>>>> One woman often complains to board members about men she sees as
>>>> creepers or sexual predators. She reports their misbehavior on
behalf of
>>>> their victims. The victims
don't initiate these reports.*
>>>>
>>>> Many others don't see these men as creepy or inappropriate.
Recently
>>>> one of the "victims" clarified that her discomfort with the man
was
a year
>>>> ago and she'd long ago dealt
with it to her satisfaction. The man in
>>>> question had heard only rumors that some nameless woman was unhappy
about
>>>> some nameless thing he'd
done.
>>>>
>>>> This woman also publicly asked that young women who feel harassed
should
>>>> talk to her about it. We feel
that's the Board's job, not hers.
>>>>
>>>> It seems that this woman is fishing for - or even inventing -
>>>> "naughty-dancer" problems.
>>>>
>>>> When a married man gets accused of being a sexual predator, his wife
has
>>>> to wonder if it's true. This
adds to any marital tensions they may
already
>>>> have. So, while this woman is
not actually punching anybody in the
face, it
>>>> seems to me that she's
committing violence.
>>>>
>>>> How should we handle this?
>>>>
>>>> I think we need a "No proxy complaints" policy - i.e., the
victim
has to
>>>> speak up (and then our process
will usually fix simple
miscommunication
>>>> issues).
>>>> We need to clearly identify board members, so genuine victims know
who
>>>> to talk to.
>>>>
>>>> But does anybody have other ideas about preventing one person's
issues
>>>> from poisoning the atmosphere of
a mostly friendly dance?
>>>>
>>>> ____
>>>> * I know, victims often have a hard time stepping up and
complaining, so
>>>> advocacy may be a good thing.
But that's a different discussion.
In these
>> situations, there's no victim; there's
no predator; there's just an
>> accusation with little to back it up.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Callers mailing list
>> Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>
>> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>>
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>
http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <javascript:;>
http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net