Laurie said, "Also, I have talked with many who have developed, as I have, a
shoulder/neck problem. This seems to come from inexperienced dancers or
assertive regular dancers (not terribly good dancers) when they FORCE a
turn, especially at an incorrect time.
"I'd love to hear from someone how to describe to a dancer who wants to
twirl what the correct timing is - can someone give me a good way to put
this out there?"
Hi Laurie,
Unless you are running a workshop that let's you go into more
detail, then the best way is probably to drip-feed hints and tips as you
teach the dances.
= = = = = = = = = =
Regarding timing, I emphasise that, while you can do what you want
in your own time and space, on beat #1 of the next phrase you and your
partner should be in the right place and facing the right way for the next
move.
So, when there is a change of direction, don't think of a move as
being 8 beats, think of it as being 6 beats plus 2 beats to transition to
the next move. This applies to, for example:
Down the hall & turn alone
Circle left/right
Star right/left
A simple flourish on the end of a swing such as an inside or outside turn
For the inexperienced: opening out from a swing into a line or circle
If the dancers are all doing the basic transitions well on beats 7 &
8 then just remind them occasionally that a twirl on the end of a swing has
to happen on beats 7 & 8 as well. Pick a dance where the transition into
the next move is demanding and remind them to finish their flourishes on
time.
Make sure the twirler knows that they are responsible for the
twirlee's timing and positioning as well as their own, and that they should
plan ahead.
= = = = = = = = = =
Regarding force, these are some of the points I make:
(Note: although contra dancing is not about lead and follow, a flourish such
as a twirl out of a swing often is - so I use the terms leader and follower
purely as indicators of who is leading and following in a flourish.)
Rule #1: Everyone is entitled to get on the dance floor and have fun without
getting hurt.
"Dancing is the vertical expression of horizontal desire", so RELAX!
A strong lead is about clarity, not strength.
(As an example, I often put my hand in an allemande position and get someone
to blow on it - as their breath hits my hand I do a complete spin. People
who want to spin don't usually need any force from their partner - they are
quite capable of spinning themselves! A strong platform can be useful to
push off, but if you try to push someone into a spin you are more likely to
push them off balance then to help them.)
When you are following, remember (as one excellent teacher used to say) "It
ain't my job to drag your ass across the floor!", so, when someone leads you
into a twirl or any other flourish, send the message straight from your
fingers to your toes and follow the lead - don't fight back!
Always start with ZERO tension and build up to what you need to execute the
move.
You aren't fighting each other - you are only fighting centrifugal force.
Unlike arm-wrestling, if your hand moves nearer to your body in an
allemande, YOU LOSE!
It's dancing not wrestling!
You are responsible for your own balance.
Leaning backwards in swings or allemandes doesn't make you go faster it just
makes your partner have to waste their energy holding you up.
= = = = = = = = = =
Of course, the people you most want to listen to these tips are
probably the ones who aren't listening!
If I seem a little passionate about this subject please forgive me,
but I have had two shoulder operations as a result of dancing, and am hoping
not to need another one.
Hope that helps! :-)
Happy dancing,
John
John Sweeney, Dancer, England john(a)modernjive.com 01233 625 362
http://www.contrafusion.co.uk for Dancing in Kent
In case you're calling on Thursday
Salute to Betsy Ross
Duple PROPER (because Betsy was proper)
A1 Long lines ("stripes") go forward and back (8); Ones swing in the
center, face down and pick up your 2s (8).
A2 All go down the hall (6), Thread the Needle** (4), come back up the
hall, bend to a hands across RH star (1s are below) (6)
B1 Turn this star once around (8), then with NEXT Ns LH star once around
8), face original Ns on the side (ones are still below the twos)
B2 Dosido this original N once around (8); just the Twos (who are above)
swing in the center (8), and back out PROPER into progressed places, ready
for long stripes/lines F/B.
**Thread the Needle:
Starts facing down. Ones are in the middle with the lady on the right.
Twos are on the outside. Everyone continues to hold hands through the
sequence.
Man 2 makes an arch -- the "eye" of the needle -- and moves across the set
toward woman 2, who leads the "thread" of hand-holding dancers through the
eye. The line unfurls with everyone facing up, with the twos still on the
outside, and the ones on the inside. A demo is often more helpful than a
verbal description.
My profound thanks to Bob Isaac, who looked at the original and said,
"Needs something." He was right, as he so often is.
April Blum
I just listened to "RadioLab" on NPR
http://www.radiolab.org/
The current show on "Inner Voices" is fascinating and has information about
how the expectations of teachers (or callers) can affect performance. The
impacts of simple word changes in how a task is described can make a
dramatic difference in how people perform that task. The show talks about
research on test performance as well as a study involving the performance
of psychomotor skills (golf).
This research dramatizes how small word choices and attitudes (or framings)
by callers could change the competence of many people in the room enough to
make the caller's job much easier or more difficult. Check it out.
The segment about the specific research begins at about 11 minutes and 15
seconds in. But the entire show is good.
Makes me think about every time I have said: "Now this part of the dance is
a little tricky."
- Greg McKenzie
West Coast, USA
As for the no-thumb allemande: Years ago, I started having a problem with
my left thumb aching for days after a dance, from the allemande lefts.
This started almost 30 years ago, so I can't blame that problem on
advancing age. As far as I'm concerned, doing an allemande without locking
thumbs is an improvement which has been made necessary by the modern
tendency to do an allemande all the way around in four beats instead of six
or eight. I'm always delighted when I run into another dancer who gives me
a no-thumb allemande. Anything that prevents injury is a good thing.
Jacob Bloom
jandnbloom(a)gmail.com
On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 12:00 PM, <callers-request(a)sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
> Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 00:03:40 -0700
> From: Erik Hoffman <erik(a)erikhoffman.com>
> To: jean francis <catherineaura(a)yahoo.com>, Caller's discussion list
> <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> Subject:
>
> Re: [Callers] First-time Contra Dancers and similar figures
> Message-ID: <51CA924C.8060601(a)erikhoffman.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
>
>
> [1] An aside: many people call this the "wrist grip" form. I encourage
> us all to remove the word "grip" from out teaching lexicon, as gripping
> has led to griping, and that (IMHO) horrid no-thumb allemande... The
> connection is through hooks and surfaces to lean on, not through
> gripping. And, although I don't like the no thumb allemande, when do I
> teach this form of star, I encourage all five fingers, thumb included,
> going over the top of the wrist in front - no grip.
>
> erik hoffman
> ~oakland, ca
>
Greg, you've been writing about integrating new dancers by getting
the experienced dancers to dance with them and even teach them the
figures. For a long time I've thought that this was a bit weird- how
could this ever work?
Then my brain finally kicked in and I realized that we live in two
very different worlds. Although it's been some time since I called
in California, I remember that the dancers there were kind, gentle
and very relaxed. They were quite a contrast to some of the dancers
back east. Maybe your method works well because of the kinds of
people who live in your area. Over the years I've seen some
hostility and resentment towards new dancers in my small part of the
world.
In one dance community, the dancers were so hostile to the new
dancers that someone started a separate dance series for the sole
purpose of having a beginner friendly dance. And before the center
line was abolished at Glen Echo, a very large percentage of
experienced dancers had absolutely no interest in dancing with
beginners.
In my area we've always had a beginning lesson and the caller always
teaches the figures. It's worked there for decades. It's the
tradition. If it ain't broke why fix it? I'm thinking that to get
the experienced dancers to teach the figures might be detrimental in
some dance communities.
This is a complicated issue and involves more than language. There's
also understanding people and their values, beliefs etc. etc.
I can't remember exactly what your background is but I'm very
interested in learning more about language and it's use. Is there a
good website or book that you could recommend?
Tom
For dances where the ends get sucked in and spat out again in the middle of
the sequence, a useful rule is:
Don't worry if you are on the wrong side when you get sucked in, just do the
move with whoever you are with - you will get spat out again soon and can
then get ready for when you really join in again.
Happy dancing,
John
John Sweeney, Dancer, England john(a)modernjive.com 01233 625 362
http://www.contrafusion.co.uk for Dancing in Kent
Great idea for a workshop for dancers, but I'm curious what the callers
approach to these types of dances are. Many of the dance weekend caliber
callers seem to take a very cavalier approach, often saying something like
"This dance has some unusual end effects, be ready and good luck" or
nothing at all. Sometimes this works out ok, sometimes not.
I like doing a star for three when I am out at the end of contra corners. Call me evil....
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: End Effect Rules / Patterns (Bill Olson)
2. Re: integrating new dancers (rich sbardella)
3. Regency for newbies (Andrea Nettleton)
4. Re: Regency for newbies (Alan Winston)
5. End Effect Rules for callers (Jim Hemphill)
6. Re: End Effect Rules / Patterns (Michael Fuerst)
7. Re: End Effect Rules for callers (Jack Mitchell)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 16:08:39 +0000
From: Bill Olson <callbill(a)hotmail.com>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Callers] End Effect Rules / Patterns
Message-ID: <BAY165-W59CD63CB4616FA8E75D398C6760(a)phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
On type #1, Rule: don't cross over immediately when waiting out, face partner and participate in dance using inevitable partner swing to change places .
On type #2 Don't know if this is a rule or not, but when women chain (let's say) to couple waiting out she thinks she's still in the dance and it's the waiting out gent's responsibility to "hold her back"... (and not get drawn back into the dance himself)..
Is it worth mentioning that a pair of couples waiting out at the end of a 4 facing 4 can face across and dance the dance with each other? That's "sort of" an end effect..
bill
> Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 16:27:24 -0400
> From: jamitch3(a)mindspring.com
> To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
> Subject: [Callers] End Effect Rules / Patterns
>
> So...I've been thinking about trying to put together a workshop for
> experienced dancerd that would consist of dances that have end effects,
> but giving the dancers some rules of thumb to go on for different types
> of end effects. Would be glad of some help brainstorming different
> general categories of end effects (grouped by "coping mechanism").
> Here's what I can come up with off the top of my head (Corrections,
> additions and clarifications welcome)
>
> Type: Dances where you pull by along the set or do things with one
> neighbor after another
> Rule: At the ends, when you don't have a neighbor, treat your partner
> like your neighbor
> Rule: If you have to pass by shadows to get back to your partner, go the
> long way at the ends -- don't try to cut the corner
>
> Type: Things on the diagonal
> Rule: If there's no one there, stay put and *keep dancing -- you're not
> out yet*
>
> Type: Shadow is also neighbor
> Rule: Know that Shadow will fill both roles
>
> Type: spit out temporarily (with partner, neighbor or shadow) and then
> come back in
> Rule: Dance with ghosts
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)sharedweight.net
> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:27:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: rich sbardella <richsbardella(a)snet.net>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Callers] integrating new dancers
Message-ID:
<1372440462.13746.YahooMailClassic(a)web184705.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
I dance regularly at three places in New England and the dancers at those venues?fit the description of those kind, gentle and very relaxed Californian dancers.
Rich
--- On Thu, 6/27/13, Tom Hinds <twhinds(a)earthlink.net> wrote:
From: Tom Hinds <twhinds(a)earthlink.net>
Subject: [Callers] integrating new dancers
To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
Date: Thursday, June 27, 2013, 8:37 AM
Greg, you've been writing about integrating new dancers by getting the experienced dancers to dance with them and even teach them the figures.? For a long time I've thought that this was a bit weird- how could this ever work?
Then my brain finally kicked in and I realized that we live in two very different worlds.? Although it's been some time since I called in California, I remember that the dancers there were kind, gentle and very relaxed.???They were quite a contrast to some of the dancers back east.? Maybe your method works well because of the kinds of people who live in your area.? Over the years I've seen some hostility and resentment towards new dancers in my small part of the world.
In one dance community, the dancers were so hostile to the new dancers that someone started a separate dance series for the sole purpose of having a beginner friendly dance.? And before the center line was abolished at Glen Echo, a very large percentage of experienced dancers had absolutely no interest in dancing with beginners.
In my area we've always had a beginning lesson and the caller always teaches the figures.? It's worked there for decades.? It's the tradition.? If it ain't broke why fix it?? I'm thinking that to get the experienced dancers to teach the figures might be detrimental in some dance communities.
This is a complicated issue and involves more than language. There's also understanding people and their values, beliefs etc. etc.
I can't remember exactly what your background is but I'm very interested in learning more about language and it's use.? Is there a good website or book that you could recommend?
Tom
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Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 23:34:51 +0100
From: Andrea Nettleton <twirly-girl(a)bellsouth.net>
To: trad-dance-callers(a)yahoogroups.com, Caller's discussion list
<callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: [Callers] Regency for newbies
Message-ID: <85AE677B-A215-48BB-ACEB-7C8F951C11BE(a)bellsouth.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
I'm in Oxford with a group of GA Tech undergrads and the Prof who is teaching a Jane Austen class has requested that I teach them a bunch of ECD from that era, things that would really have been danced then. I don't have with me the resources I had available in the states. I need a selection of maybe a dozen dances, and a resource from which to give them interesting tidbits about etiquette, flirtation, the circumstances of a ball such as chaperones, the necessity for an introduction before inter gender conversation could occur, etc. I want something as authentic as possible, but they are all newbies and I want them to have fun. Recommendations most welcome. I have a fiddler and a Barnes book, and notes for a few dances and any I can glean from the web, unless one of my esteemed colleagues loans them to me. I'm confident about the teaching part, it is more a matter of what to present.
Thanks
Andrea
Sent from my iPad
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 16:05:58 -0700
From: Alan Winston <winston(a)slac.stanford.edu>
To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
Subject: Re: [Callers] Regency for newbies
Message-ID: <51CE16D6.3000606(a)slac.stanford.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
On 6/28/2013 3:34 PM, Andrea Nettleton wrote:
> I'm in Oxford with a group of GA Tech undergrads and the Prof who is teaching a Jane Austen class has requested that I teach them a bunch of ECD from that era, things that would really have been danced then. I don't have with me the resources I had available in the states. I need a selection of maybe a dozen dances, and a resource from which to give them interesting tidbits about etiquette, flirtation, the circumstances of a ball such as chaperones, the necessity for an introduction before inter gender conversation could occur, etc. I want something as authentic as possible, but they are all newbies and I want them to have fun. Recommendations most welcome. I have a fiddler and a Barnes book, and notes for a few dances and any I can glean from the web, unless one of my esteemed colleagues loans them to me. I'm confident about the teaching part, it is more a matter of what to present.
> Thanks
> Andrea
>
I just send Andrea a big file of dance notes off-list. That file has
mid-1700s to early 1800s in it - probably too much, but I had it already
made up. For Jane Austen class it's probably more apropos to do
Austen's lifetime (1775-1817) than strictly Regency (1811-1820).
For extremely authentic you'd be teaching them to make up dances out of
building block figures. Many of the reconstructed Austen-era dances for
modern dancers have been tweaked; triple minors often became
three-couple sets. There's a number of 1740s or 1750s dance patterns
that are very much like c.1800 dance patterns.
Suggestions more closely focused on Austen's lifetime and general
accessiblity, as I think of them and not in the order I would present them
Haste to the Wedding (as a longways set, not Sicilian Circle)
Midnight Ramble
Young Widow
Marlbrouk Cotillion
Dover Pier
Trip to Tunbridge (contra corners, similar to Chorus Jig)
North Down Waltz
Long Odds (requires the ability to RH turn 1.5 in four bars, which may
be challenging)
Physical Snob
Prince William (crossover mirror hey _and_ contra corners!)
Rakes of Rochester
The Spaniard
The Bishop (gypsy is historically questionable)
Dover Pier
(If your fiddler doesn't like any of those tunes - and I hear "the
Bishop" can be a bear to play - it would be period practice to use the
figures with a different tune.)
Hope this helps!
-- Alan
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 19:04:50 -0500
From: Jim Hemphill <arcadian35(a)gmail.com>
To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
Subject: [Callers] End Effect Rules for callers
Message-ID:
<CAL3h0BR23EhOAb=vG8Db04PdZEe04Bu0kSaZMkC5BrXShpVNgA(a)mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Great idea for a workshop for dancers, but I'm curious what the callers
approach to these types of dances are. Many of the dance weekend caliber
callers seem to take a very cavalier approach, often saying something like
"This dance has some unusual end effects, be ready and good luck" or
nothing at all. Sometimes this works out ok, sometimes not.
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 21:42:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Fuerst <mjerryfuerst(a)yahoo.com>
To: "jamitch3(a)mindspring.com" <jamitch3(a)mindspring.com>, Caller's
discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Callers] End Effect Rules / Patterns
Message-ID:
<1372480928.50470.YahooMailNeo(a)web122202.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Actually this strikes me a bad idea for a workshop.
Dances with challenging end effects have such because of the interesting stuff within the dances.
Dancers will not be enlightened by the ?end effects.
So just do a workshop of advanced dances.
Dancers just will remember at most ?one or two instruction for end effects, and it should be the most important instruction . ? For example:
? ? ? a) ?Dance around at the ends, or
? ? ? b) When out at the end, face back in with man on right, woman on left (which I do not think has been suggested yet). ? or
? ? ? c) You'll will pop in and out at the end several times
If the dancers in front of the caller aren't skilled enough to handle the end effects with one or two brief items of advice, s/he should consider calling a different dance
Some ideas for workshops
a) ?Proper dances. ? ?? There are small number of interesting proper dances where bout couples are equally active. ?Tom Hinds probably has written the most of these. ? ??
? ? ? ? ?Al Olson has a dance Contra Corners Special. ? ?Mark Richardson, David?Kirchner?and I have written one.
? ? ? ? ?Roger Diggle has several elegant, but uneven proper dance
b) ?Quirky dances. ? ?Dances with seemingly bizarre choreography, but which are fun.
? ? ? ? ?Kirston Koths wrote quite a few of these in the 1980's
? ? ? ? ?Mike Boerschig has one called the The Fishin' Reel
? ? ? ? ?Claudio Buchwald has one, I think it's in Zesty Contras
c) Quirky Formations (e.g. 1's crossed, backwards progressions, 1's start below 2's)
?
Michael Fuerst ? ? ?802 N Broadway ? ? ?Urbana IL 61801?????? 217-239-5844
Links to photos of many of my drawings and paintings are at www.ArtComesFuerst.com
________________________________
From: Jack Mitchell <jamitch3(a)mindspring.com>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 3:27 PM
Subject: [Callers] End Effect Rules / Patterns
So...I've been thinking about trying to put together a workshop for
experienced dancerd that would consist of dances that have end effects,
but giving the dancers some rules of thumb to go on for different types
of end effects.? Would be glad of some help brainstorming different
general categories of end effects (grouped by "coping mechanism").?
Here's what I can come up with off the top of my head (Corrections,
additions and clarifications welcome)
Type: Dances where you pull by along the set or do things with one
neighbor after another
Rule: At the ends, when you don't have a neighbor, treat your partner
like your neighbor
Rule: If you have to pass by shadows to get back to your partner, go the
long way at the ends -- don't try to cut the corner
Type: Things on the diagonal
Rule: If there's no one there, stay put and *keep dancing -- you're not
out yet*
Type: Shadow is also neighbor
Rule: Know that Shadow will fill both roles
Type: spit out temporarily (with partner, neighbor or shadow) and then
come back in
Rule: Dance with ghosts
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Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2013 01:33:45 -0400
From: Jack Mitchell <jamitch3(a)mindspring.com>
To: Caller's discussion list <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Callers] End Effect Rules for callers
Message-ID: <51CE71B9.9040402(a)mindspring.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
My goal in the workshop would be to give people tools that they can use
to make sense of at least a large subset of dances with challenging end
effects by trying to come up with the smallest number of general
categories of end effects / coping skills possible, and avoiding having
to give specific instructions for that dance -- the first time you go
out wait out with the lady on the left, then wait out on the right
diagonal, and such as that. While I strongly doubt that I can cover
every possible type of end effect, I think that it should be possible to
cover some general categories of end effect and to give folks some
structure for dealing with them. I would really like to help the
dancers find the patterns so that they can better cope with end effects
when they come along...
I'm going to sit down with some of the things that folks have posted
this weekend and with my dance box and see what I can come up with.
Jack
On 6/28/2013 8:04 PM, Jim Hemphill wrote:
> Great idea for a workshop for dancers, but I'm curious what the callers
> approach to these types of dances are. Many of the dance weekend caliber
> callers seem to take a very cavalier approach, often saying something like
> "This dance has some unusual end effects, be ready and good luck" or
> nothing at all. Sometimes this works out ok, sometimes not.
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)sharedweight.net
> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>
>
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)sharedweight.net
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End of Callers Digest, Vol 106, Issue 38
****************************************
I'm in Oxford with a group of GA Tech undergrads and the Prof who is teaching a Jane Austen class has requested that I teach them a bunch of ECD from that era, things that would really have been danced then. I don't have with me the resources I had available in the states. I need a selection of maybe a dozen dances, and a resource from which to give them interesting tidbits about etiquette, flirtation, the circumstances of a ball such as chaperones, the necessity for an introduction before inter gender conversation could occur, etc. I want something as authentic as possible, but they are all newbies and I want them to have fun. Recommendations most welcome. I have a fiddler and a Barnes book, and notes for a few dances and any I can glean from the web, unless one of my esteemed colleagues loans them to me. I'm confident about the teaching part, it is more a matter of what to present.
Thanks
Andrea
Sent from my iPad
So...I've been thinking about trying to put together a workshop for
experienced dancerd that would consist of dances that have end effects,
but giving the dancers some rules of thumb to go on for different types
of end effects. Would be glad of some help brainstorming different
general categories of end effects (grouped by "coping mechanism").
Here's what I can come up with off the top of my head (Corrections,
additions and clarifications welcome)
Type: Dances where you pull by along the set or do things with one
neighbor after another
Rule: At the ends, when you don't have a neighbor, treat your partner
like your neighbor
Rule: If you have to pass by shadows to get back to your partner, go the
long way at the ends -- don't try to cut the corner
Type: Things on the diagonal
Rule: If there's no one there, stay put and *keep dancing -- you're not
out yet*
Type: Shadow is also neighbor
Rule: Know that Shadow will fill both roles
Type: spit out temporarily (with partner, neighbor or shadow) and then
come back in
Rule: Dance with ghosts
