Jeff,
I had another thought in regard to resistance to an annual membership. We had membership
dues pre-pandemic (same cost) that gave you $1 off the set $5 admission charge each week
and allowed you to vote at the Annual Meeting. But membership was not mandatory.
In June, 2021, when we decided to try moving from Zoom dancing to outdoor dancing, we had
a "town hall” type meeting allowing each person present to share their comfort levels
and what would make them more comfortable thinking about dancing again. From those
discussions we decided to return to dancing, but outdoors, with masks, and for members
only. What we heard is that people were more comfortable dancing with people they knew or
were friends of people they knew. That there was some connection to the group beyond a
one-time dance. However, we also allowed people to become members if they had not joined
in 2020 (we extended those paid memberships through all of our online dancing.) We didn’t
really advertise our dance to the greater community at that time. We simply used our
existing email list and Facebook page, and slowly grew the dance back up through that.
Knowing that people were members and likely had some connection to some other member, made
people more comfortable at that time, knowing that if Covid cases did arise, we would
likely learn about them.
The unexpected result was that people kept bringing their friends who joined and were
looking for this kind of outlet. The policy turned out to be a positive one for us that we
kept even when we returned to indoor dancing.
I will say, I imagine we would have met more resistance to this policy if it had not come
out of pandemic protocols. But now, it’s just the norm for us.
--Mary Jean
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From: Mary Jean Regoli<mailto:mjregoli@outlook.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2022 9:24 AM
To: Jeff Kaufman<mailto:jeff@alum.swarthmore.edu>
Cc: organizers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>
Subject: RE: [Organizers] Re: [External] Re: Electronic admission payments
Jeff,
It’s rare that the membership requirement is prohibitive. It might catch someone traveling
through by surprise, however the $12 annual fee (or $2 for those under 30) is no more than
they would pay to go out to a club or for another dance. And they are not required to make
a donation for the performers. We are fine with them simply paying the membership fee
their first time out. Many dance communities charge $10 or more for their dances. Last
year, starting in October we let people choose to pay $15 to finish out the year and cover
the next year’s membership.
What it has done is allowed us to be sure we get contact information for all newcomers,
which was hit and miss before. It also provides contact tracing info if we need it. And
lets us check people in more efficiently at future dances once they are registered with
us. We simply need to check their name off on the list and hand them their wristband. It
also seems to encourage people to come back more frequently as they have already paid the
membership fee, and feel like they belong, and that we are there for them whenever they
want to attend again. Our membership list has more than doubled, and young people are
bringing their friends. Many people don’t come every week, but they do come back when they
can.
--Mary Jean
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From: Jeff Kaufman<mailto:jeff@alum.swarthmore.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2022 9:05 AM
To: Mary Jean Regoli<mailto:mjregoli@outlook.com>
Cc: organizers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Organizers] Re: [External] Re: Electronic admission payments
"we moved to requiring annual membership in the group to participate ($12 a year for
most; $2 annual for Under age 30) and then making the dances donation only with a
suggested range of $3 - $20"
That's a really interesting model! I would be worried that this would dissuade
newcomers who felt like they needed to buy a membership in an organization that they were
just trying out? Is that something you run into?
Jeff
On Wed, Aug 31, 2022 at 12:13 AM Mary Jean Regoli via Organizers
<organizers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>>
wrote:
Agreed – good discussion! We mostly use PayPal for our electronic payments, but want to
look into Venmo as well. When we started this, Venmo Business wasn’t a thing, but now it’s
possible for us as an org to have an account. We have used PayPal for years to allow
people to make annual membership payments, and annual “Subscription” payments for the
dance. This was something we initiated where people pay a reduced rate if they pay for the
whole year in advance. Then they didn’t need to worry about having $5 in cash on hand each
week, and likely would feel better stopping by for a few dances even if they couldn’t stay
the whole night. So it also encouraged better attendance 😊 We’re a small dance group, so
this is important to us.
With the pandemic and our weekly Zoom dances, we started accepting donations for the dance
each week through PayPal. When we returned to in-person dances, we kept the PayPal
donation option, displaying QR codes at the check-in table for both membership and dance
donation, as well as a jar for cash or checks. One good thing about PayPal is people can
set up a weekly or monthly recurring payment. You can create separate buttons for various
initiatives like Membership or Weekly Dance, so those payments are labeled as such and can
have customized options.
When we returned to in-person dances, we moved to requiring annual membership in the group
to participate ($12 a year for most; $2 annual for Under age 30) and then making the
dances donation only with a suggested range of $3 - $20. This has worked out very well for
us, and we feel we can be more inclusive and welcoming to people who don’t have cash on
hand on any given night. And while we still need volunteers to check people in, they don’t
have to monitor cash payments. Requiring membership seems to have helped us create a more
invested community.
We pay per performer up to a max of 3 for each band, plus travel when performers are from
out of town. Most performers are fine with being paid by PayPal, and this is easiest for
me to track payments. I pay callers and each band member individually through PayPal
unless they request otherwise. I do ask bands if they are OK with PayPal payment, and I
will give mostly checks and occasionally cash to performers if they prefer. Before the
pandemic, the previous treasurer always paid in cash. We rarely take in enough to cover
our expenses each week (performer stipends + hall rental), so this meant as a treasurer
you had to go to the bank and get cash each week. PayPal is much more efficient and
transparent. We make up the difference through income from our annual weekend dance.
Paying performers via PayPal also means I don’t have to make arrangements to have someone
else pay them in person if I can’t attend a dance one week. I just have to verify that all
of the scheduled performers showed up.
We have encountered times/venues where cell signals were weak and/or wifi was unavailable
where people could not make an e-payment on site. However, folks are good about following
through later if they say they will make a payment for membership or dance donation.
Mary Jean Regoli
Bloomington Old Time Music and Dance Group
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From: Mary Collins via Organizers<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2022 11:39 AM
To: Tepfer, Seth<mailto:labst@emory.edu>
Cc: organizers shared weight<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>
Subject: [Organizers] Re: [External] Re: Electronic admission payments
Good thread. We have been asked as well, particularily about memberships. A donor sents us
2 android phones to keep with dance admin stuff so we can start. This way no one person is
tied to the process. We are looking at square, which as a bookkeeper is pretty
straightforward to track and account for. Fees are pretty nominal.
The negative for me as a caller is will there be cash to get paid with. I was recently
surprised by a check payment. I normally do ALL cash transaction as much as possible so
was wanting that cash for gas to get the 70+ miles home. We (our group) always pays in
cash and most of our performers prefer it. So that IMHO is a consideration when taking
electronic payments in any form
Mary Collins
On Mon, Aug 29, 2022, 11:31 AM Tepfer, Seth via Organizers
<organizers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>>
wrote:
Great question and discussion point.
At the dance 8/5, upon entering the gym, attendees were greeted at the front desk with
signs showing multiple payment options:
• QR code for Venmo
• QR code for PayPal
• QR code for Cash App
• A jar for stuffing cash in
• Instructions on how to use ApplePay
I would estimate we had around 60 people dancing. A generous smattering of new dancers and
dancers under forty years old. Payments received:
• 3: Venmo (plus the fiddler paid via venmo)
• 2: Cash App
• 1: ApplePay
• 0: PayPal
• 54: jar with cash and checks (approximately)
The dance was sliding scale admission - people were told they could pay what they wished,
and donation requested was $20.
In the future we will replace the PayPal QR code with Zelle QR code.
We are discussion a big change to our accounting practices: create a separate account just
for handling the finances of the local dance. It will have just enough money in it to pay
the talent (band, sound, caller) electronically. The treasurer or scheduler will find out
prior to the dance if the talent wants to be paid electronically or in cash.
Seth
Seth Tepfer, MBA, CSM, PMP (he, him, his)
Senior IT Manager, Emory Primate Center
From: Jeff Kaufman via Organizers
<organizers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2022 11:20 AM
To: organizers shared weight
<organizers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>>
Subject: [External] [Organizers] Re: Electronic admission payments
We started accepting Venmo with our most recent dance (we're "BIDA-dance" on
Venmo). There's a fee, so we don't advertise this prominently, but we do have it
for people who ask. About 10% of our income was Venmo on Saturday night.
Previously we'd do this ad-hoc, where someone would send money to me (or someone else)
and I'd put cash from my wallet into the till, but that's not great.
One risk would be that if we took in enough of the money electronically we wouldn't
have enough cash to pay the performers. We're not close to that currently, but if it
did happen we'd need to get set up for writing checks at dances.
Jeff
(Patrick, I think list etiquette here is to respond on list; not sure why you don't
want us replying to the list? If you're not interested in this thread you should be
able to "mute" it in your mail client.)
On Mon, Aug 29, 2022 at 9:50 AM John Sweeney via Organizers
<organizers@lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>>
wrote:
We very successfully use a Zettle Card Reader linked to a Smartphone.
The only customer data we get on their reports is the last four digits of
their card number. So, in case we have to follow up on any errors, we log
everyone's name and the last four digits of their card.
We only have one person on the door, so they use their phone. If you have
multiple personnel then that could be more challenging.
The more expensive version, Zettle Terminal, doesn't need a phone.
Happy dancing,
John
John Sweeney, Dancer, England john@modernjive.com<mailto:john@modernjive.com>
01233 625 362 & 07802
940 574
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