Jeff,
It’s rare that the membership requirement is prohibitive. It might catch someone traveling through by surprise, however the $12 annual fee (or $2 for those under 30) is no more than they would pay to go out to a club or for another dance. And they are not required to make a donation for the performers. We are fine with them simply paying the membership fee their first time out. Many dance communities charge $10 or more for their dances. Last year, starting in October we let people choose to pay $15 to finish out the year and cover the next year’s membership.
What it has done is allowed us to be sure we get contact information for all newcomers, which was hit and miss before. It also provides contact tracing info if we need it. And lets us check people in more efficiently at future dances once they are registered with us. We simply need to check their name off on the list and hand them their wristband. It also seems to encourage people to come back more frequently as they have already paid the membership fee, and feel like they belong, and that we are there for them whenever they want to attend again. Our membership list has more than doubled, and young people are bringing their friends. Many people don’t come every week, but they do come back when they can.
--Mary Jean
Sent from Mail for Windows
From: Jeff Kaufman
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2022 9:05 AM
To: Mary Jean Regoli
Cc: organizers@lists.sharedweight.net
Subject: Re: [Organizers] Re: [External] Re: Electronic admission payments
"we moved to requiring annual membership in the group to participate ($12 a year for most; $2 annual for Under age 30) and then making the dances donation only with a suggested range of $3 - $20"
That's a really interesting model! I would be worried that this would dissuade newcomers who felt like they needed to buy a membership in an organization that they were just trying out? Is that something you run into?
Jeff
On Wed, Aug 31, 2022 at 12:13 AM Mary Jean Regoli via Organizers <organizers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Agreed – good discussion! We mostly use PayPal for our electronic payments, but want to look into Venmo as well. When we started this, Venmo Business wasn’t a thing, but now it’s possible for us as an org to have an account. We have used PayPal for years to allow people to make annual membership payments, and annual “Subscription” payments for the dance. This was something we initiated where people pay a reduced rate if they pay for the whole year in advance. Then they didn’t need to worry about having $5 in cash on hand each week, and likely would feel better stopping by for a few dances even if they couldn’t stay the whole night. So it also encouraged better attendance 😊 We’re a small dance group, so this is important to us.
With the pandemic and our weekly Zoom dances, we started accepting donations for the dance each week through PayPal. When we returned to in-person dances, we kept the PayPal donation option, displaying QR codes at the check-in table for both membership and dance donation, as well as a jar for cash or checks. One good thing about PayPal is people can set up a weekly or monthly recurring payment. You can create separate buttons for various initiatives like Membership or Weekly Dance, so those payments are labeled as such and can have customized options.
When we returned to in-person dances, we moved to requiring annual membership in the group to participate ($12 a year for most; $2 annual for Under age 30) and then making the dances donation only with a suggested range of $3 - $20. This has worked out very well for us, and we feel we can be more inclusive and welcoming to people who don’t have cash on hand on any given night. And while we still need volunteers to check people in, they don’t have to monitor cash payments. Requiring membership seems to have helped us create a more invested community.
We pay per performer up to a max of 3 for each band, plus travel when performers are from out of town. Most performers are fine with being paid by PayPal, and this is easiest for me to track payments. I pay callers and each band member individually through PayPal unless they request otherwise. I do ask bands if they are OK with PayPal payment, and I will give mostly checks and occasionally cash to performers if they prefer. Before the pandemic, the previous treasurer always paid in cash. We rarely take in enough to cover our expenses each week (performer stipends + hall rental), so this meant as a treasurer you had to go to the bank and get cash each week. PayPal is much more efficient and transparent. We make up the difference through income from our annual weekend dance. Paying performers via PayPal also means I don’t have to make arrangements to have someone else pay them in person if I can’t attend a dance one week. I just have to verify that all of the scheduled performers showed up.
We have encountered times/venues where cell signals were weak and/or wifi was unavailable where people could not make an e-payment on site. However, folks are good about following through later if they say they will make a payment for membership or dance donation.
Mary Jean Regoli
Bloomington Old Time Music and Dance Group
Sent from Mail for Windows
From: Mary Collins via Organizers
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2022 11:39 AM
To: Tepfer, Seth
Cc: organizers shared weight
Subject: [Organizers] Re: [External] Re: Electronic admission payments
Good thread. We have been asked as well, particularily about memberships. A donor sents us 2 android phones to keep with dance admin stuff so we can start. This way no one person is tied to the process. We are looking at square, which as a bookkeeper is pretty straightforward to track and account for. Fees are pretty nominal.
The negative for me as a caller is will there be cash to get paid with. I was recently surprised by a check payment. I normally do ALL cash transaction as much as possible so was wanting that cash for gas to get the 70+ miles home. We (our group) always pays in cash and most of our performers prefer it. So that IMHO is a consideration when taking electronic payments in any form
Mary Collins
On Mon, Aug 29, 2022, 11:31 AM Tepfer, Seth via Organizers <organizers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Great question and discussion point.
At the dance 8/5, upon entering the gym, attendees were greeted at the front desk with signs showing multiple payment options:
· QR code for Venmo
· QR code for PayPal
· QR code for Cash App
· A jar for stuffing cash in
· Instructions on how to use ApplePay
I would estimate we had around 60 people dancing. A generous smattering of new dancers and dancers under forty years old. Payments received:
· 3: Venmo (plus the fiddler paid via venmo)
· 2: Cash App
· 1: ApplePay
· 0: PayPal
· 54: jar with cash and checks (approximately)
The dance was sliding scale admission - people were told they could pay what they wished, and donation requested was $20.
In the future we will replace the PayPal QR code with Zelle QR code.
We are discussion a big change to our accounting practices: create a separate account just for handling the finances of the local dance. It will have just enough money in it to pay the talent (band, sound, caller) electronically. The treasurer or scheduler will find out prior to the dance if the talent wants to be paid electronically or in cash.
Seth
Seth Tepfer, MBA, CSM, PMP (he, him, his)
Senior IT Manager, Emory Primate Center
From: Jeff Kaufman via Organizers <organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>
Sent: Monday, August 29, 2022 11:20 AM
To: organizers shared weight <organizers@lists.sharedweight.net>
Subject: [External] [Organizers] Re: Electronic admission payments
We started accepting Venmo with our most recent dance (we're "BIDA-dance" on Venmo). There's a fee, so we don't advertise this prominently, but we do have it for people who ask. About 10% of our income was Venmo on Saturday night.
Previously we'd do this ad-hoc, where someone would send money to me (or someone else) and I'd put cash from my wallet into the till, but that's not great.
One risk would be that if we took in enough of the money electronically we wouldn't have enough cash to pay the performers. We're not close to that currently, but if it did happen we'd need to get set up for writing checks at dances.
Jeff
(Patrick, I think list etiquette here is to respond on list; not sure why you don't want us replying to the list? If you're not interested in this thread you should be able to "mute" it in your mail client.)
On Mon, Aug 29, 2022 at 9:50 AM John Sweeney via Organizers <organizers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
We very successfully use a Zettle Card Reader linked to a Smartphone.
The only customer data we get on their reports is the last four digits of
their card number. So, in case we have to follow up on any errors, we log
everyone's name and the last four digits of their card.
We only have one person on the door, so they use their phone. If you have
multiple personnel then that could be more challenging.
The more expensive version, Zettle Terminal, doesn't need a phone.
Happy dancing,
John
John Sweeney, Dancer, England john@modernjive.com 01233 625 362 & 07802
940 574
http://contrafusion.co.uk/KentCeilidhs.html for Live Music Ceilidhs
http://www.contrafusion.co.uk for Dancing in Kent
http://www.modernjive.com for Modern Jive DVDs
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