Import1 August 2016

import1@lists2.sharedweight.net

1 participants
47 discussions

[Callers] Favorite dance to teach a ladies chain?

by Luke Donforth via Callers

Hello all, I've been thinking about glossary dances, and building vocabulary for new dancers. I'm curious what your favorite dance is for teaching a ladies chain for a crowd of mostly new dancers? Or if you don't have a specific dance, what do you look for in a dance to make the chain as accessible as possible? Just a chain over? Or a full chain over and back? Chain to neighbor? Chain to partner? What move best precedes the chain to set it up? What move best follows the chain that still helps new dancers succeed? Other factors you consider? I don't have a go-to favorite, but I'll walk through some of the things I think about: I very seldom call a dance with a full chain. Experienced dancers don't whoop and holler over them, and for new dancers, I'd worry the confusion would snowball. Programatically, in a hall with a reasonable mix of new and experienced dancers, I shoot for the first chain to be to neighbor so that the new dancers can feel it with different experienced dancers; rather than new dancers (who will partner up and clump, no matter how many helpful dance angels you have) continually chaining to each other. If I were trying to teach a chain to ALL new dancers... well, I doubt I'd teach a chain to completely new dancers... but if I were, I'd probably go to partner. For moves, while I love the chain->left hand star transition; I'm not convinced it's the best for teaching the chain. It often goes B2 chain->star, find new neighbor; and the new neighbor from a left hand star is non-trivial for new dancers. Possibly a dance where the chain->star wasn't followed by the progression would work, but it's such a great progression when they're ready for it; I don't see many of those dances. chain->star->left allemande maybe? I do like long lines either before or after the chain as a set-up; but not on both ends. I'm not sure which side of the chain the lines help more. The Trip to ___ dances that end with chains and start with women walking in to long wavy lines flow well, but I don't know that they're the best for teaching chains, since the long wavy line is another new piece. Anyway, just some of my thoughts (started by the other thread about simple glossary dances). I look forward to hearing what others on Shared Weight have to say about the dances they use to teach chains (and I certainly won't be offended if folks tangent off into gent's chains; just start a new thread ;-) Take care, -- Luke Donforth Luke.Donforth(a)gmail.com <Luke.Donev(a)gmail.com>

8 years, 4 months

Re: [Callers] Surely this already exists?

by Luke Donforth via Callers

Thank you to everyone who chimed in; fun to hear about all the versions and folks preferences. I, personally, am glad my (digital) box is big enough for all of the variations. I can see instances where I'd use any of them. With predominately new dancers on the first duple improper of the evening, I think the ladies on their own for an allemande would fare better than the "help" gents can give on the courtesy turn of a chain. I agree with Jack that chain->face new neighbor can be a tough transition. But Troxler's is straightforward enough that you could use it to focus on teaching a chain to new dancers; with a forgiving squishy entry into the DSD. And I haven't broken a hundred times yet with Nice Combination, but I'm sure I will. Thanks again. This discussion has even got me thinking about another thing I'd like to discuss on shared weight. On Mon, Aug 22, 2016 at 4:56 AM, Bob Isaacs <isaacsbob(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > Hi All: > > > While I appreciate Jack's comments about the chain/B&S progression, that > is more of a teaching issue than a choreographic one. More important is > how much assistance those in the ladies role can get from their partner in > B2b. In a chain they can get that from the joined hands in the long > lines. But for the allemande L they need to let go from their partner and > are on their own. That help would occur if Luke's dance finished with a > ladies allemande R 1 1/2, but that would not flow as well into the next > neighbor dosido. So I'll stick with Nice Combo/Troxler's on the > Loose/Forgotten Treasure - > > > Bob > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Callers <callers-bounces(a)lists.sharedweight.net> on behalf of > Jack Mitchell via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> > *Sent:* Sunday, August 21, 2016 10:27 PM > *To:* Linda Leslie; Luke Donforth > *Cc:* Callers(a)Lists.Sharedweight.net > *Subject:* Re: [Callers] Surely this already exists? > > Though I know that there are lots of traditional dances with a ladies > chain (turn away) new N...., I am really not crazy about them. Ok....I'll > admit it, I actively dislike them. Particularly for new dancers, and > particularly going to a discrete move like a balance. It requires the lady > to extricate themselves from a previous neighbor (who *should certainly > not* twirl and forget, but frequently does), and requires the (polite) > gent to turn away from their direction of progression to get new ladies > pointed in the right direction at the end of the courtesy turn before the > gent can progress (and for that matter, requires the courtesy turn to be > either done more quickly, or otherwise to be cut short to get everyone > going in the right direction. (don't even get me started on dances that > have a butterfly whirl -> turn away to a new neighbor). (There are dances > -- like Punctuated Raindrops -- that have that progression, that I will > still call a) because they're great dances other than that and b) because > the timing of the progression isn't discrete -- if you're late to start the > allemande L, it's ok, the timing will work out in the wash.) </rant> > > The ladies allemande L progression, 1) puts the ladies in a bit more > control, 2) allows the caller to point out where they're going, and who > they're going to and 3) leaves a free hand available to reach out to the > new neighbor. Even with similarities in the rest of the dance, I think > that is really enough to make it a distinct (and a more accessible) dance > from the ones mentioned. > > Jack > > On Sun, Aug 21, 2016 at 9:53 PM Linda Leslie via Callers < > callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: > >> This dance is virtually the same as Troxler’s on the Loose, by Chris >> Ricciotti. The only difference in Chris’ dance is that the final move is a >> ladies chain. >> Beth Parkes also wrote a dance that is mostly the same: Forgotten >> treasure. She begins the dance with a N B&S, and ends it with a chain as >> well. >> Linda >> >> On Aug 21, 2016, at 9:10 PM, Luke Donforth via Callers < >> callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: >> >> > Hello all, >> > >> > I was trying to find an easy and accessible dance, a real glossary >> basic contra. >> > >> > I feel like this must already exist, but I'm not finding it in my >> notes. Someone got a prior? >> > >> > Type: Contra >> > Formation: Duple-Improper >> > >> > A1 ----------- >> > (8) Neighbor Do-si-do >> > (8) Neighbor swing, end facing down the hall >> > A2 ----------- >> > (8) Down the hall, four in line (turn as couples) >> > (8) Return and Bend the line >> > B1 ----------- >> > (6) Circle Left 3/4 >> > (10) Partner swing >> > B2 ----------- >> > (8) Long lines, forward and back >> > (8) Women allemande Left 1-1/2 >> > >> > The B2 could be W DSD 1.5, although I like the allemande for the >> connection for brand new dancers. I specifically chose the left hand to >> leave the women facing towards their new neighbor. >> > >> > I know it's really close to a bunch of other stuff. B2 could be C L >> 3/4, balance and pass through; or chain to left hand star à la The Nice >> Combination; etc. >> > >> > Barring it already having been named by someone else, I'm going to call >> it "Having Fun with PAM" to keep track of it in my box; since I just got >> back from the fabulous PAMFest (Peacham Acoustic Music Festival). >> > >> > Thanks. >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Callers mailing list >> > Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net >> > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Callers mailing list >> Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net >> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net >> > -- > Jack Mitchell > Durham, NC > -- Luke Donforth Luke.Donforth(a)gmail.com <Luke.Donev(a)gmail.com>

8 years, 4 months

Re: [Callers] looking for notes

by tavi merrill via Callers

it's easy to collect from this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6LlCUhPwnM& > Anybody have Marty Fager's "Balance and Bounce" handy? > > Many thanks, > Kalia Kliban > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Callers mailing list > Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Callers Digest, Vol 28, Issue 12 > *************************************** >

8 years, 4 months

Re: [Callers] On Balances, Box circulates, Allemandes, Circles & Timing

by Chet Gray via Callers

Thanks for your commentary, Erik. In regards to the direction of balances before allemandes, I agree for the most part, but I see one aspect you left out: eye contact. I know not everybody uses eye contact when balancing towards someone, just as not everybody uses eye contact in swings or allemandes, but many folks do, and I know folks who find the eye contact first with one person, then with another during a right-left (or left-right) balance to be not only very satisfying, but an important social component of the figure. I have a tendency to look at dances in a very technical manner, when calling as well as when dancing or playing. I consciously try to let that go when it is unnecessary. When deciding on the wording to use for a dance, I try to consider whether it **really** matters to the momentum to specify what direction the dancers balance in, or to let them enjoy it as they will (coming from what may be a last bastion of hands-across-star-by-default, I do this for star grip as well). For a different point, if the balance before the allemande is by one hand only—instead of, say, from a wave—balancing toward-away-from the person often makes more physical sense than a half-supported forward-back. In regards to circles, circumference, and styling, I love the points you make. I enjoy when callers bring up (carefully selected) style notes for oft-ignored aspects of the dance, such as how radial distance affects speed (and, therefore timing) in not only circles, but allemandes and two-hand-turns. My recent crusade (to be a bit hyperbolic) has been "turning takes time" during down-the-halls. Time will tell how effective it is at alleviating line drift... On Sun, Aug 21, 2016 at 4:31 PM, Erik Hoffman via Callers < callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: > There’s been a discussion on balancing forward & back, or right & left, or > starting the balance left, then right when the balance precedes a left > allemande. And there’s been a discussion on the timing of circles. Like, > does a circle left ¾ take 6 or 8 beats? And how long should a circle left > 1¼ take? > > > > *Balances & Direction* > > > > I think it was Cammy Kaynor who told me he always teaches, “Balance in the > direction you’re going to go.” This, as stated, is obvious in a box > circulate: you’re going to go forward after the balance. It’s also obvious > in a Rory O’More type balance: the balance is right, then left making that > right slide or twirl gratifying. And it’s the one place where we do teach > the left then right balance, to make that slide/twirl left so cool. Now, > consider the allemande: > > > > The initial motion of an allemande is forward. The connection of arms is > what turns the forward motion into a circular motion. It is not very > satisfying to balance right—tension in the left arm—then left—no tension in > the left arm—then go into an allemande left. But a forward & back creates > some loss of tension in both arms, then tension in both arms, and you can > even favor tension in the left arm facilitating a wonderful launch into > that left allemande. When doing this there is no need to alter our “normal” > right then left balance. Thus I’ve strongly adopted the above rule: *Balance > in the Direction you’re going to go*. And remember: the initial direction > of an allemande—any allemande—is forward. Thus following this rule yields > satisfying results whether the balance precedes a left or a right > allemande. I try to bring this up whenever I teach a dance. > > > > *Circles, Allemandes, & Circumference* > > > > Back in the old days (when I started dancing in the 1980s), callers could > and would give styling points. We did dances where, in 8 beats, we might > allemande left once, dances with an 8 beat 1½ allemande, and dances, like > Hull’s Victory, where we’d make it twice around in 8 beats. Some of us were > taught that we could get a good connection and give good weight by varying > the circumference of the circle we traveled. Keep arms wide, travel a > larger circle, and once around in 8 beats feels great! Pull in close, and > you can make it around twice in 8 beats. > > > > At times there has been discussion about how a circle left ¾, swing > someone is a 6, then 10 beat set of figures. I think of it as 8 & 8, but > let dancers do whatever they want. Then we have a circle left ¾, ring > balance, California twirl. The timing of this is definitely 8, 4, 4. > > > > It is easy to have a good connection, give good weight in a circle ¾, and > make it last 6 or 8 beats by expanding or contracting the circle. Aware > dancers will adjust to make the move fit the timing of the dance. Circle > left ¾ into a balance: make the circle bigger so the path is a bit longer. > Want that extra two beats of swing? Contract the circle, and get there > early… > > > > I do agree that a circle left 1¼ in 8 beats does not work well. So, make > the circle a bit bigger and turn it into a zesty 12 beats. > > > > Erik Hoffman > > Oakland, CA > > _______________________________________________ > Callers mailing list > Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net > >

8 years, 4 months

Re: [Callers] Surely this already exists?

by Bob Isaacs via Callers

Hi All: While I appreciate Jack's comments about the chain/B&S progression, that is more of a teaching issue than a choreographic one. More important is how much assistance those in the ladies role can get from their partner in B2b. In a chain they can get that from the joined hands in the long lines. But for the allemande L they need to let go from their partner and are on their own. That help would occur if Luke's dance finished with a ladies allemande R 1 1/2, but that would not flow as well into the next neighbor dosido. So I'll stick with Nice Combo/Troxler's on the Loose/Forgotten Treasure - Bob ________________________________ From: Callers <callers-bounces(a)lists.sharedweight.net> on behalf of Jack Mitchell via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2016 10:27 PM To: Linda Leslie; Luke Donforth Cc: Callers(a)Lists.Sharedweight.net Subject: Re: [Callers] Surely this already exists? Though I know that there are lots of traditional dances with a ladies chain (turn away) new N...., I am really not crazy about them. Ok....I'll admit it, I actively dislike them. Particularly for new dancers, and particularly going to a discrete move like a balance. It requires the lady to extricate themselves from a previous neighbor (who should certainly not twirl and forget, but frequently does), and requires the (polite) gent to turn away from their direction of progression to get new ladies pointed in the right direction at the end of the courtesy turn before the gent can progress (and for that matter, requires the courtesy turn to be either done more quickly, or otherwise to be cut short to get everyone going in the right direction. (don't even get me started on dances that have a butterfly whirl -> turn away to a new neighbor). (There are dances -- like Punctuated Raindrops -- that have that progression, that I will still call a) because they're great dances other than that and b) because the timing of the progression isn't discrete -- if you're late to start the allemande L, it's ok, the timing will work out in the wash.) </rant> The ladies allemande L progression, 1) puts the ladies in a bit more control, 2) allows the caller to point out where they're going, and who they're going to and 3) leaves a free hand available to reach out to the new neighbor. Even with similarities in the rest of the dance, I think that is really enough to make it a distinct (and a more accessible) dance from the ones mentioned. Jack On Sun, Aug 21, 2016 at 9:53 PM Linda Leslie via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:callers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote: This dance is virtually the same as Troxler’s on the Loose, by Chris Ricciotti. The only difference in Chris’ dance is that the final move is a ladies chain. Beth Parkes also wrote a dance that is mostly the same: Forgotten treasure. She begins the dance with a N B&S, and ends it with a chain as well. Linda On Aug 21, 2016, at 9:10 PM, Luke Donforth via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:callers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote: > Hello all, > > I was trying to find an easy and accessible dance, a real glossary basic contra. > > I feel like this must already exist, but I'm not finding it in my notes. Someone got a prior? > > Type: Contra > Formation: Duple-Improper > > A1 ----------- > (8) Neighbor Do-si-do > (8) Neighbor swing, end facing down the hall > A2 ----------- > (8) Down the hall, four in line (turn as couples) > (8) Return and Bend the line > B1 ----------- > (6) Circle Left 3/4 > (10) Partner swing > B2 ----------- > (8) Long lines, forward and back > (8) Women allemande Left 1-1/2 > > The B2 could be W DSD 1.5, although I like the allemande for the connection for brand new dancers. I specifically chose the left hand to leave the women facing towards their new neighbor. > > I know it's really close to a bunch of other stuff. B2 could be C L 3/4, balance and pass through; or chain to left hand star à la The Nice Combination; etc. > > Barring it already having been named by someone else, I'm going to call it "Having Fun with PAM" to keep track of it in my box; since I just got back from the fabulous PAMFest (Peacham Acoustic Music Festival). > > Thanks. > _______________________________________________ > Callers mailing list > Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:Callers@lists.sharedweight.net> > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net<mailto:Callers@lists.sharedweight.net> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net -- Jack Mitchell Durham, NC

8 years, 4 months

Re: [Callers] Surely this already exists?

by Linda Leslie via Callers

This dance is virtually the same as Troxler’s on the Loose, by Chris Ricciotti. The only difference in Chris’ dance is that the final move is a ladies chain. Beth Parkes also wrote a dance that is mostly the same: Forgotten treasure. She begins the dance with a N B&S, and ends it with a chain as well. Linda On Aug 21, 2016, at 9:10 PM, Luke Donforth via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: > Hello all, > > I was trying to find an easy and accessible dance, a real glossary basic contra. > > I feel like this must already exist, but I'm not finding it in my notes. Someone got a prior? > > Type: Contra > Formation: Duple-Improper > > A1 ----------- > (8) Neighbor Do-si-do > (8) Neighbor swing, end facing down the hall > A2 ----------- > (8) Down the hall, four in line (turn as couples) > (8) Return and Bend the line > B1 ----------- > (6) Circle Left 3/4 > (10) Partner swing > B2 ----------- > (8) Long lines, forward and back > (8) Women allemande Left 1-1/2 > > The B2 could be W DSD 1.5, although I like the allemande for the connection for brand new dancers. I specifically chose the left hand to leave the women facing towards their new neighbor. > > I know it's really close to a bunch of other stuff. B2 could be C L 3/4, balance and pass through; or chain to left hand star à la The Nice Combination; etc. > > Barring it already having been named by someone else, I'm going to call it "Having Fun with PAM" to keep track of it in my box; since I just got back from the fabulous PAMFest (Peacham Acoustic Music Festival). > > Thanks. > _______________________________________________ > Callers mailing list > Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net

8 years, 4 months

Re: [Callers] Surely this already exists?

by Luke Donforth via Callers

Excuse me, that B1 is Partner Swing, not Partner Neighbor. (Thank you David Harding for catching my copy/paste error) A1 ----------- (8) Neighbor Do-si-do (8) Neighbor swing, end facing down the hall A2 ----------- (8) Down the hall, four in line (turn as couples) (8) Return and Bend the line B1 ----------- (6) Circle Left 3/4 (10) Partner swing B2 ----------- (8) Long lines, forward and back (8) Women allemande Left 1-1/2

8 years, 4 months

[Callers] Surely this already exists?

by Luke Donforth via Callers

Hello all, I was trying to find an easy and accessible dance, a real glossary basic contra. I feel like this must already exist, but I'm not finding it in my notes. Someone got a prior? Type: Contra Formation: Duple-Improper A1 ----------- (8) Neighbor Do-si-do (8) Neighbor swing, end facing down the hall A2 ----------- (8) Down the hall, four in line (turn as couples) (8) Return and Bend the line B1 ----------- (6) Circle Left 3/4 (10) Partner neighbor B2 ----------- (8) Long lines, forward and back (8) Women allemande Left 1-1/2 The B2 could be W DSD 1.5, although I like the allemande for the connection for brand new dancers. I specifically chose the left hand to leave the women facing towards their new neighbor. I know it's really close to a bunch of other stuff. B2 could be C L 3/4, balance and pass through; or chain to left hand star à la The Nice Combination; etc. Barring it already having been named by someone else, I'm going to call it "Having Fun with PAM" to keep track of it in my box; since I just got back from the fabulous PAMFest (Peacham Acoustic Music Festival). Thanks.

8 years, 4 months

[Callers] On Balances, Box circulates, Allemandes, Circles & Timing

by Erik Hoffman via Callers

There’s been a discussion on balancing forward & back, or right & left, or starting the balance left, then right when the balance precedes a left allemande. And there’s been a discussion on the timing of circles. Like, does a circle left ¾ take 6 or 8 beats? And how long should a circle left 1¼ take? Balances & Direction I think it was Cammy Kaynor who told me he always teaches, “Balance in the direction you’re going to go.” This, as stated, is obvious in a box circulate: you’re going to go forward after the balance. It’s also obvious in a Rory O’More type balance: the balance is right, then left making that right slide or twirl gratifying. And it’s the one place where we do teach the left then right balance, to make that slide/twirl left so cool. Now, consider the allemande: The initial motion of an allemande is forward. The connection of arms is what turns the forward motion into a circular motion. It is not very satisfying to balance right—tension in the left arm—then left—no tension in the left arm—then go into an allemande left. But a forward & back creates some loss of tension in both arms, then tension in both arms, and you can even favor tension in the left arm facilitating a wonderful launch into that left allemande. When doing this there is no need to alter our “normal” right then left balance. Thus I’ve strongly adopted the above rule: Balance in the Direction you’re going to go. And remember: the initial direction of an allemande—any allemande—is forward. Thus following this rule yields satisfying results whether the balance precedes a left or a right allemande. I try to bring this up whenever I teach a dance. Circles, Allemandes, & Circumference Back in the old days (when I started dancing in the 1980s), callers could and would give styling points. We did dances where, in 8 beats, we might allemande left once, dances with an 8 beat 1½ allemande, and dances, like Hull’s Victory, where we’d make it twice around in 8 beats. Some of us were taught that we could get a good connection and give good weight by varying the circumference of the circle we traveled. Keep arms wide, travel a larger circle, and once around in 8 beats feels great! Pull in close, and you can make it around twice in 8 beats. At times there has been discussion about how a circle left ¾, swing someone is a 6, then 10 beat set of figures. I think of it as 8 & 8, but let dancers do whatever they want. Then we have a circle left ¾, ring balance, California twirl. The timing of this is definitely 8, 4, 4. It is easy to have a good connection, give good weight in a circle ¾, and make it last 6 or 8 beats by expanding or contracting the circle. Aware dancers will adjust to make the move fit the timing of the dance. Circle left ¾ into a balance: make the circle bigger so the path is a bit longer. Want that extra two beats of swing? Contract the circle, and get there early… I do agree that a circle left 1¼ in 8 beats does not work well. So, make the circle a bit bigger and turn it into a zesty 12 beats. Erik Hoffman Oakland, CA

8 years, 4 months

[Callers] Looking for notes

by Kalia Kliban via Callers

Anybody have Marty Fager's "Balance and Bounce" handy? Many thanks, Kalia Kliban

8 years, 4 months

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Import1 August 2016