[Callers] Ladies

Mon Oct 16 12:43:33 PDT 2017

I had a chance to use Larks and Ravens when I called for the Brooklyn
contra this summer.  I really liked it, better than any of the others I've
tried, and got multiple positive comments too.  That said, I pulled it off
by making a new set of cards (on my iPad) so that I had the correct terms
in front of me.  Once I got started calling, though, the terms felt really
intuitive, both for me and the dancers.  I'm so glad that the Brooklyn
organizers were willing to give it a try (they had normally used "leads"
and "follows", which I feel pretty strongly aren't good options for contra
for multiple reasons, both gender related and due to how contra works as a
dance form).

J

On Sun, Oct 15, 2017 at 1:58 PM Carol Geisler via Callers <
callers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

> Hi Angela, Looking forward to hearing about your personal experiences as a
> caller and dance organizer with these new terms.
>
> On Sun, Oct 15, 2017 at 1:33 PM, Mary Collins via Callers <
> callers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
>> Angela, ah....I see said the blind person. Now it makes sense. Will not
>> work in my home ultra conservative community and I will certainly need to
>> practice replacing. It will be interesting to say the least.
>> Thanks again!
>>
>> On Oct 15, 2017 12:21 AM, "Angela DeCarlis" <aedecarlis at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Mary! A lot has already been written on the subject elsewhere, but
>>> the summary of why Larks and Ravens has become a great set of terms is that
>>> they correlate to the (L)eft and (R)ight positions at the end of a swing.
>>> The syllable count is the same when compared to Gent and Lady (or Man and
>>> Woman, for that matter), and the terms don't conflict with any dance
>>> instructions (like how Lead and Follow would, especially if used to call
>>> for English or Square Dancing).
>>>
>>> Another great set of terms are Jets and Rubies, but I've found those
>>> labels to be more arbitrary...the main advantage is that the words are
>>> phonetically similar to Gents and Ladies...and I'm not sure whether or not
>>> that's a good thing!
>>>
>>> I hope this helps clarify things for you, and I thank you in advance for
>>> keeping an open mind about trying these new, genderfree terms soon! In the
>>> communities I've danced in, I can't tell you how much of a positive
>>> difference these terms have made for individual dancers and for the
>>> communities on the balance. But again, more on that can be read elsewhere,
>>> and I hope to write in with more about my personal experiences as a caller
>>> and dance organizer soon!
>>>
>>> Angela
>>>
>>> On Oct 14, 2017 2:09 PM, "Mary Collins" <nativedae at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ahem Tom...that would be "gender" lol....Seriously, being of the more
>>>> mature (and I use that term loosely) set, I find all these new names for
>>>> ROLES to be troublesome and tiresome.  Who exactly is a Lark & who exactly
>>>> are Ravens?  Because quite frankly I have mental pictures of both....from
>>>> literature and music and they could be as offending as gents & ladies or
>>>> women & men....not to try to start anything here.  I am just trying to
>>>> grasp something that seems to be just a wee bit beyond my reach.  Several
>>>> of my fellow traveling dance friends (of similar age) do not understand
>>>> these terms either.  Since I plan to be traveling and hopefully calling in
>>>> "your community" sometime, I'd really like to get a handle on this.
>>>>
>>>> Mary "24" Collins
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail> Virus-free.
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>>>>
>>>> “Life is not about waiting for the storms to pass ... it's about
>>>> learning to dance in the rain!” ~ Unknown
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Oct 14, 2017 at 12:15 PM, Tom Hinds <twhinds at earthlink.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Angela.  If only we could easily change our gender so we could
>>>>> understand what it's like to be the other sex.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Oct 14, 2017, at 11:32 AM, Angela DeCarlis wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Tom, I had this conversation with Sue Rosen this summer. Women who
>>>>> belong to the original Feminist generation (like Sue and, presumably, like
>>>>> Mary and Martha above) were involved in a cultural movement to abolish the
>>>>> word "Lady", along with its restrictive connotations, in favor of "Woman".
>>>>> The latter label, I understand, was one which lent more power and ownership
>>>>> to its wearers, and so was preferable. You could be however you were,
>>>>> "ladylike" or not, and still be a Woman. (others, please chime in if I've
>>>>> gotten anything wrong or missed anything!)
>>>>>
>>>>> My generation has an opposite problem: due to the modern-day Gender
>>>>> Revolution, wherein we seek to abolish the gender dichotomy, terms like
>>>>> "Woman" and "Man" feel too restrictive and denotative. "Lady" and "Gent"
>>>>> feel almost more comfortable to some, since they are words that are
>>>>> slightly more flexible, in some ways.
>>>>>
>>>>> One of the biggest problems for both groups, I think, is when the
>>>>> terms are used interchangeably.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is one of my favorite things to think about when it comes to role
>>>>> terms in dance today! I *love* our community's intergenerationality, and
>>>>> learning about each other through conversations like this!
>>>>>
>>>>> Eventually I hope to get around to writing in about the changes I've
>>>>> seen at BIDA since switching to Larks and Ravens at the beginning of the
>>>>> summer. It's been truly remarkable!
>>>>>
>>>>> 'Til then,
>>>>> Angela
>>>>>
>>>>> On Oct 14, 2017 9:26 AM, "Mary Collins via Callers" <
>>>>> callers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Martha, I dont recall this dance of which you speak. Could you share
>>>>>> the true title and calls? Thanks! I also cringe over ladies (I don't fit
>>>>>> that tradition) yet it is a good "place holder, ROLE identifer" for my
>>>>>> communities.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Oct 14, 2017 9:06 AM, "Tom Hinds via Callers" <
>>>>>> callers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I must have fallen asleep during a discussion of "ladies".  What's
>>>>>>> the issue?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > On Oct 11, 2017, at 12:13 PM, Martha Wild via Callers <
>>>>>>> callers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > I’ve got a gypsy star dance (I actually call it “Star Wrong” and
>>>>>>> not just because of the g-word, but because if you say “gypsy star”
>>>>>>> everybody starts to gypsy and NOT star, so I gave up on that confusing
>>>>>>> terminology). Haven’t seen another dance like it. The move from mad robin
>>>>>>> into the star wrong actually flows quite well.  I use men and women for
>>>>>>> roles, not genders. When I first started calling, we considered “lady” to
>>>>>>> be a four letter word - women’s movement and bra burning and all that. I
>>>>>>> still find it hard to use the word “lady” and not bristle. Times have
>>>>>>> changed, now people bristle at men and women. Go figure. I didn’t correct
>>>>>>> the “g-word” use on this version
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
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>>
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-- 
Jack Mitchell
Durham, NC
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