[Callers] Rotation shifts (was: Another dance-check zig-zag R dance)

Ron Blechner via Callers callers at lists.sharedweight.net
Tue Mar 14 21:57:54 PDT 2017

As long as you're opening this line of thought, here's some more thoughts:

Should we thus also say that every circle L / star R to circle R / star L
transition has equally no place in contra? Because that's even more of a
pronounced shift in rotational direction. (To be clear: with same
neighbors, not as a transition.)

I can imagine a counter-point would be noting that the swing is unique
because it's a tighter rotation, and so it's not the same as stars/circles.

But then how do we explain the frequency of dances with swing to ladies
allemande right / ladies pass right to start a hey? It's absolutely ladies
going from clockwise swing rotation to moving the opposite direction.

Or how about some other frequently used transitions (from most frequent)?:

Chain / R+L Thru to circle left. (Common, and a change in vector for both

Chain/star promenade to Face Next neighbor, DSD/"Gypsy"/Allemandes R with
that new neighbor. (Less common, but I dance one of these every few weeks,
on average.)

Contra Corners dances where ladies role has to make both a hand and
direction change (like... Chorus Jig)

And maybe the answer someone might give is "these are all bad flow". Yet
people seem to like many dances with them in it. I would be interested to
find out why.

In dance,

On Mar 14, 2017 11:41 PM, "Bob Isaacs" <isaacsbob at hotmail.com> wrote:

Ron and All:

I respectfully disagree.  As long as we swing in a clockwise direction, the
swing/circle R transition will flow poorly for both roles, and should
have no place in any contra dance -


*From:* Ron Blechner <contraron at gmail.com>
*Sent:* Tuesday, March 14, 2017 11:19 PM
*To:* Bob Isaacs
*Cc:* Caller's discussion list
*Subject:* Re: [Callers] Another dance-check zig-zag R dance

I dance the ladies role enough where I feel I can confidently assert that
swing -> circle R is as difficult for gents as swing -> circle L is for
ladies. Either way, one person is unfolding from the swing opposite from
the rotation of the subsequent circle.

The bigger objection to flow is simply that it's a circle right that is
from a standstill, and people don't dance many circle rights. (But we dance
plenty circle lefts from a standstill.) In this case, I'm interested in the
circle R as something to fill a second-half-of-evening slot where I often
have need for dances that are fairly easy but not the same old circle
lefts, swings, stars, chains, and allemandes.


On Mar 14, 2017 11:05 PM, "Bob Isaacs via Callers" <
callers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

> Hi Ron:
> Two transitions in this dance I find troubling.  The R and L through/gents
> allemande is awkward for the gents, whose L hand is occupied in the
> courtesy turn of the R and L through.  This can be avoided by 1/2 hey (GL,
> PR, LL, NR), gents allemande L 1 1/2 (or allemande/hey if you prefer that
> order).
> But swing/circle R?
> Bob
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Callers <callers-bounces at lists.sharedweight.net> on behalf of Ron
> Blechner via Callers <callers at lists.sharedweight.net>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 14, 2017 9:49:10 PM
> *To:* callers
> *Subject:* [Callers] Another dance-check zig-zag R dance
> So, this is a cross between Jeff Spero's Kiss the Bride and Rick Mohr's
> Rockin' Robin:
> Duple Imp.
> A1. N DSD (6)
>        NS (10)
> A2. R+L Thru (8) (across)
>        Gents Alle L 1.5x (8)
> B1. P Meltdown Swing (16)*
> B2. Circle R 1.25x (10)
>        Zig R, Zag L (6) (to next Ns)
> I was futzing with Kiss the Bride and this came out. I'd like to give
> credit if it's been written, or pick a name if not.
> In dance,
> Ron Blechner
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers at lists.sharedweight.net
> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
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