In my OP I was really referring to ONS-type events for beginners such as was inflicted upon hapless beginners at the Southbank RFH Clore Ballroom on Jan 1 2017.. This is the group I was witnessing - notice the caller in silver pants - FGS. https://www.southbankcentre.co.uk/whats-on/118768-ceilidh-liberation-front-… http://ceilidhliberationfront.co.uk/ They might be subverting the lore of the ceilidh whatever - but they can't call dances. As I witnessed there was far too much gab from their caller(s), during which the attention of their audience - the general pubic - was lost. The muffled sound system - shouting didn't help - made whatever they were saying completely inaudible anyway. Why didn't their caller(s) use radio mics to call from the floor with the dancers? Aha - perhaps the ego-tripping of subversion performance is enhanced by remaining aloof on the stage? If this is subversion then they succeeded. Sadly ceilidhs / folk dances are rarely held at the Southbank. This was yet another opportunity lost. CJB P.S. And 'no' telling them to lessen the gab and increase the dancing wasn't an option.