Re: [Callers] Another approach to Gender Free calling - Import1

1 Jun 2015

We have a caller in the Mad Robin group that calls our monthly dance that
doesn't use gendered terms. They only call a few dances in the evening, so
it's easier to pick a few dances that you can finesse around the language.

If you go into every swing saying where you end relative to the person
you're swinging "swing your neighbor and end in their place" versus
"swing
your neighbor and end where you started" lets you say "the folks that ended
on the right now allemande in the middle", etc. It's finaglable, but gets
cumbersome.

Jim, while I applaud your dedication to making it happen, I'd personally
want the buy-in and support of my community before engineering a vocabulary
restructuring (we did an entire evening using explicit gender free at our
monthly dance, it was warmly received as a one-off, but folks were not
eager to see a permanent transition). A large part of the knowledge
transfer to new dancers happens between the folks on the floor; and if
you're using different language than the community, I worry about the new
dancers.

As a small note, I personally object to the idea that "chain" by itself is
fine in this context; as it's using a learned association without
acknowledging it. To me, it seems to reinforce the dichotomy while making
the dance less accessible to new dancers.

On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 1:23 PM, Dave Casserly via Callers <
callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote:

...
  Also with regard to Ron's questions, numbers 2 and
3 (who-leads-whom and
 who-walks-forward) can be handled by using the terms "clockwise" and
 "counterclockwise."  As to 4 (who passes whom for a hey), I agree with Bob
 that if the dance is good, it should be obvious, but even if not, "pass
 left shoulders in the middle for a hey for four" can only be interpreted
 one way, so that fixes the issue of referring to roles.  Roll-aways can be
 handled with "roll away from the left to the right" or "roll away from
the
 right to the left."

 I'm not saying that it's perfect, but it is actually quite doable to call
 a dance without referring to roles at all, even without resorting to first
 or second corners.

 Perry asked for an example of a dance with global terminology used.
 Here's one (just picking a common, typical dance):

 Square Affair, by Becky Hill

 A1 Long Lines, 1st corners chain (or just say "chain" if you're dealing
 with experienced dancers and don't want to use the corners terminology)
 A2 Balance and pull by partner, pull by neighbor, balance and pull by
 partner, pull by neighbor
 B1 New neighbors balance and swing
 B2 Circle 3/4, partner swing

 Perry, you also mentioned that you are trying to figure out how global
 terminology would work for proper dances.  I have always called proper
 dances using global terminology without even thinking about it.  For Chorus
 Jig, for instance, why would you ever need to use the term "gent" or
 "lady"?  Down the outside, back, down the middle, back and neighbor
 around-the-waist turn, 1s turn contra corners, 1s balance and swing.
 Nothing that any particular role does that the other role isn't doing at
 the same time.

 On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 9:41 AM, Bob Morgan via Callers <
 callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote:

  With regard to Ron's questions

 1. Would be easily covered by 1st or 2nd corners walk forward to a wave

 2. Again can be done with reference to corners

 3. Not so familiar with these.

 4. You usually only need an obvious first pass person so not an issue I
 think

 5.  If you're facing out you turn, if you're facing across you walk is
 how I call it anyway

 Bob

 On Mon, Jun 1, 2015 at 5:09 PM, Ron Blechner via Callers <
 callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote:

  Andrea, how would you handle the following:

 1. Lines of one role/position to the center to a wavy line, as in Trip
 to Lambertville, et all?

 2. Indication of who walks forward / backs up in a gypsy star?

 3. Indication of who-leads-who, such as in Ramsay Chase, Pedal Pushers,
 Jurassic Redheads, etc.

 4. Indication of who is passing while calling a hey.

 5. Indication of who crosses, who turns in a box circulate?

 6. Indication any other role/position specific move that I haven't
 mentioned? Turn over right shoulder, as in Fairport Harbour? Rollaways?

 None of these fall under the "most unusual figures" as you stated.

 Ron
 On Jun 1, 2015 11:59 AM, "Andrea Nettleton via Callers" <
 callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote:

  In previous discussions here, on FB, and
privately with organizers at
 Hampshire over the last two years, I have discussed the possible use of
 global terminology for gender free contra.  I would contend that if used,
 everyone would become more aware of the structure of dances.  Only the most
 unusual figures/sequences would be unable to be called.  The addition of
 first and second corner positions to the arsenal makes it possible for same
 role dancers to also be called upon to dance together without reference to
 gender.  Second corners chain, or first corners allemande L 1 1/2 for
 example.  It would have to be agreed that this refers to those standing in
 those positions at that moment.  In ECD we use first and second corners to
 refer to the people, first and second diagonals for the positions.  But
 since we use diagonal to refer to those across and over one set, this seems
 unhelpful.  Simply corner positions works better.  I'm glad some folks are
 trying it out at last.  I had hoped for an opportunity myself before now.
 Cheers,
 Andrea

 Sent from my iOnlypretendtomultitask

 On Jun 1, 2015, at 8:37 AM, Jim Hemphill via Callers <
 callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net&gt; wrote:

 The recent discussions on this topic inspired me to try an experiment
 in gender free calling.  Last night I called the contra dance in St. Louis
 using gender free calling without telling anyone.    The experiment was a
 great success.  I received lots of  positive feedback on the evenings
 dance.  At the break and after the dance I made a point to ask several
 dancers, some were callers as well, if they noticed anything different or
 unusual about the dances or how I taught them.   One person noticed that
 there were more dances that included a swing in the center for couple 2
 than usual.  No one I talked to noticed that the calls and teaching were
 gender free.

 It took some extra time to construct a fun, diverse 3 hour program, but
 it is certainly possible.  Re-labeling the dancers is not the only way to
 call gender free.

 If you are interested in the program I used or the larger collection of
 gender free dances I chose the program from, send me an email,
 arcadian35(a)gmail.com.

 Thanks,
 Jim Hemphill

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