My understanding is that Lynn adapted Ron Beeson's dance, Apple Pie Quadrille, by changing B2 into a can't-fail circle progression from a "Devil's Backbone" progression.
I'm going to guess that Nils called it at a dance and somebody misattributed the dance to him and got the name wrong.
Here's the notation Ridge Kennedy posted for Apple Pie Quadrille on the trad-dance-callers list:
APPLE PIE QUADRILLE
Ron Beeson (via Ridge Kennedy)
Four Facing Four
Called by Kathy Anderson at Buffalo gap 2002
Ask for lively music that's a bit silly to suit the dance.
A-1 Lines of Four, Forward and Back
(Reminder - this is original direction!) (8)
Center Four (dancers in the middle of each line of four):
Star Right Once Around (8)
A-2 Partners Allemande Left Once and a Half (8)
Ends (Original ends of each line of four, now Center Four)
Star Right Once Around (8)
B-1 Partners balance and swing (16)
B-2 "End Man" (Man on left end of line):Lead back over left shoulder to
invert line. Lead around the *other* end of the other line and all
face original direction and a new line of four. (16)
Notes: Tricky Part: Leading the line back and around is counter-intuitive.
End man starts turning in opposite direction that his line is progressing.
Original dance:
A-1 Lines forward and back (8) All do sa do opposite dancer (8)
A-2 Centre four star right (8) All allemande left with partner x 3/2 (8)
B-1 New centre four star right (8) All swing partners (8)
B-2 Circle left all eight once round (16)
C-1 The left hand man casts left taking his line around the other line
to face the next line (16)
-- Alan
On 5/29/2019 5:36 PM, Liz Burkhart via Callers wrote:
I have found two identical dances. First I collected Coconut Cream Puff by Nils Fredland, then I lost the card, and in the process of looking for it online, discovered Coconut Cream Pie by Lynn Ackerson. It is the same dance:
4 Facing 4
A1 Lines of 4 go forward and back
middles star R once
A2 Partner allemande L 1 1/2
new middles star R once
B1 Partner balance & swing
B2 All 8 circle L 1/2 (4 places)
Balance ring, partner California twirl
So who really wrote it? Does anyone know why there are two names and two choreographers attributed?
_______________________________________________
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Hi, Liz,
I have that choreography as "Coconut Cream Pie" by Lynn Ackerson. I
collected it that way from Nils Fredland a few years ago.
Dugan Murphy
(he/him)
Portland, Maine
dugan at duganmurphy.comwww.DuganMurphy.comwww.PortlandIntownContraDance.comwww.NufSed.consulting
Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 20:36:43 -0400
> > From: Liz Burkhart <burkhart.liz(a)gmail.com>
> > To: callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
> > Subject: [Callers] Coconut Cream Puff vs Pie + choreographer?
> >
> > I have found two identical dances. First I collected Coconut Cream Puff
> by
> > Nils Fredland, then I lost the card, and in the process of looking for it
> > online, discovered Coconut Cream Pie by Lynn Ackerson. It is the same
> > dance:
> >
> > 4 Facing 4
> > A1 Lines of 4 go forward and back
> > middles star R once
> > A2 Partner allemande L 1 1/2
> > new middles star R once
> > B1 Partner balance & swing
> > B2 All 8 circle L 1/2 (4 places)
> > Balance ring, partner California twirl
> >
> >
> > So who really wrote it? Does anyone know why there are two names and two
> > choreographers attributed?
>
Angela, I clicked on the link and it took me to the Diversions Leveret album in Spotify but didn’t identify a specific tune. What is the name of the tune?
> On Jun 8, 2019, at 06:08, Angela DeCarlis via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
> PS, here's the tune! A bit below contra tempo in the recording, but still oh so good.
>
> https://open.spotify.com/track/0DS00P9yV0T9BGjBj0sBWI?si=3XW4rAcKTX657rphlN… <https://open.spotify.com/track/0DS00P9yV0T9BGjBj0sBWI?si=3XW4rAcKTX657rphlN…>
>
> On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 9:07 AM Angela DeCarlis <aedecarlis(a)gmail.com <mailto:aedecarlis@gmail.com>> wrote:
> Hello all!
>
> In a scene with which I'm sure many of you are familiar, I woke up in the middle of the night with a tune stuck in my head, and I couldn't fall asleep until I'd written a dance to go with it.
>
> Let me know if someone's beat me to it:
>
> Molly Apple Pye, Becket
>
> A1: Balance Ring, Petronella
> Balance Ring, Pass through up and down
> A2: New Neighbor Balance and Swing
> B1: Gents start 3/4 Hey across (GL PR LL NR GL PR),
> Ladies Ricochet*
> B2: Partner Swing
>
> I realize the partner swing in this version is longer than standard, but figure since the timing can run long for a full hey with ricochet and since the next move is a ring balance, I don't mind giving the dancers the extra time to get their affairs in order. ;)
>
> *But maybe the timing works better if the Ladies dance a left-shoulder-round instead, to take up a bit more music? I need to play-test! In that case, the B's would be,
>
> B1: Gents start 3/4 Hey across (GL PR LL NR GL PR),
> Ladies Left Shoulder Round
> B2: Partner Right Shoulder Round and Swing
>
> Thanks!
> Angela
> _______________________________________________
> List Name: Callers mailing list
> List Address: Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
> Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/callers@lists.sharedweight.net/
PS, here's the tune! A bit below contra tempo in the recording, but still
oh so good.
https://open.spotify.com/track/0DS00P9yV0T9BGjBj0sBWI?si=3XW4rAcKTX657rphlN…
On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 9:07 AM Angela DeCarlis <aedecarlis(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello all!
>
> In a scene with which I'm sure many of you are familiar, I woke up in the
> middle of the night with a tune stuck in my head, and I couldn't fall
> asleep until I'd written a dance to go with it.
>
> Let me know if someone's beat me to it:
>
> Molly Apple Pye, Becket
>
> A1: Balance Ring, Petronella
> Balance Ring, Pass through up and down
> A2: New Neighbor Balance and Swing
> B1: Gents start 3/4 Hey across (GL PR LL NR GL PR),
> Ladies Ricochet*
> B2: Partner Swing
>
> I realize the partner swing in this version is longer than standard, but
> figure since the timing can run long for a full hey with ricochet and since
> the next move is a ring balance, I don't mind giving the dancers the extra
> time to get their affairs in order. ;)
>
> *But maybe the timing works better if the Ladies dance a
> left-shoulder-round instead, to take up a bit more music? I need to
> play-test! In that case, the B's would be,
>
> B1: Gents start 3/4 Hey across (GL PR LL NR GL PR),
> Ladies Left Shoulder Round
> B2: Partner Right Shoulder Round and Swing
>
> Thanks!
> Angela
>
Hello all!
In a scene with which I'm sure many of you are familiar, I woke up in the
middle of the night with a tune stuck in my head, and I couldn't fall
asleep until I'd written a dance to go with it.
Let me know if someone's beat me to it:
Molly Apple Pye, Becket
A1: Balance Ring, Petronella
Balance Ring, Pass through up and down
A2: New Neighbor Balance and Swing
B1: Gents start 3/4 Hey across (GL PR LL NR GL PR),
Ladies Ricochet*
B2: Partner Swing
I realize the partner swing in this version is longer than standard, but
figure since the timing can run long for a full hey with ricochet and since
the next move is a ring balance, I don't mind giving the dancers the extra
time to get their affairs in order. ;)
*But maybe the timing works better if the Ladies dance a
left-shoulder-round instead, to take up a bit more music? I need to
play-test! In that case, the B's would be,
B1: Gents start 3/4 Hey across (GL PR LL NR GL PR),
Ladies Left Shoulder Round
B2: Partner Right Shoulder Round and Swing
Thanks!
Angela
Hi All,
In the first video link in Callers Box, one dancer is doing an interesting addition at A2b:
A2 Partner allemande L 1 1/2;
New middles star R once WHILE new ends Neighbor swing.
Cheers, Bill
Thank you! That sure does look like the same dance except B2 (or in the
original, C1!)
On Thu, May 30, 2019 at 6:36 PM <callers-request(a)lists.sharedweight.net>
wrote:
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>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Coconut Cream Puff vs Pie + choreographer? (Liz Burkhart)
> 2. Re: Coconut Cream Puff vs Pie + choreographer? (Winston, Alan P.)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 20:36:43 -0400
> From: Liz Burkhart <burkhart.liz(a)gmail.com>
> To: callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
> Subject: [Callers] Coconut Cream Puff vs Pie + choreographer?
> Message-ID:
> <CAEQ=jxCz=
> 2syXFyoF6bE8BPrm2NcQnbVHomdKD3T+fmztR8qtg(a)mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I have found two identical dances. First I collected Coconut Cream Puff by
> Nils Fredland, then I lost the card, and in the process of looking for it
> online, discovered Coconut Cream Pie by Lynn Ackerson. It is the same
> dance:
>
> 4 Facing 4
> A1 Lines of 4 go forward and back
> middles star R once
> A2 Partner allemande L 1 1/2
> new middles star R once
> B1 Partner balance & swing
> B2 All 8 circle L 1/2 (4 places)
> Balance ring, partner California twirl
>
>
> So who really wrote it? Does anyone know why there are two names and two
> choreographers attributed?
>
I have found two identical dances. First I collected Coconut Cream Puff by
Nils Fredland, then I lost the card, and in the process of looking for it
online, discovered Coconut Cream Pie by Lynn Ackerson. It is the same dance:
4 Facing 4
A1 Lines of 4 go forward and back
middles star R once
A2 Partner allemande L 1 1/2
new middles star R once
B1 Partner balance & swing
B2 All 8 circle L 1/2 (4 places)
Balance ring, partner California twirl
So who really wrote it? Does anyone know why there are two names and two
choreographers attributed?
Michael Dyck and my contra dance database project, the Caller's Box,
http://www.ibiblio.org/contradance/thecallersbox/
now includes links for about 1,900 dances to about 8,000 youtube videos.
They're currently unsorted, but hopefully after a few random clicks on
the currently 115 identified videos of Gene Hubert's "Butter",
there'll be an interesting one.
-Chris Page
San Diego, CA
In Otter Creek Books, in Middlebury VT, the other day I picked up a little book called “Prompting: How to do it”, by John M. Schell, “One of Boston’s leading prompters”. It “Contains the figures of all modern dances in common use, and how to call them”. It was published by Carl Fisher Inc (whom I think of as a music publisher) in 1890.
It contains instructions for numerous multi-part quadrilles (Plain, Lancers, Caledonian, Double Lancers, Saratoga Lancers, etc), and a couple of individual square dances. It also has about 120 contra dances, all in proper formation and almost all described as duple (many seem as though they could just as well be done improper). The instructions say they are for six-couple sets. Every contra is to be followed by “All forward (4); turn partners (4); all promenade around the hall.” (I interpret this as forward and back, swing partner, promenade.). The ones that have familiar names (Petronella, Money Musk, Hull’s Victory, Vinton’s Hornpipe etc) have a family resemblance to the dances that were codified by Ralph Page and others or appear e.g. in Zesty Contras, but often aren't quite the same.
This book was apparently one of Ralph Page’s main sources, and he felt free to update them some as he adapted them. in 1995, in connection with the 8th Ralph Page Legacy weekend at UNH, Tony Parkes wrote: "In preparing for this session, I reread Ralph's account of his early years as a caller ("One More Couple: Some Memories of 30 Years of Calling." Northern Junket, vol. 6 no. 12 and vol. 7 no. 1. February and May 1960) and discovered that Ralph learned to call with the aid of two different books: Prompting: How To Do It by John M. Schell (1890) and The Prompter’s Handbook, edited by J.A. French (1893)".
Here is some of the advice from the first few pages of the book. It looks like the task and role of the prompter/caller have not changed very much in 129 years:
—————————————————
Be a gentleman always; many questions will be asked and many minds to please. Answer each in a pleasant manner in every instance.
Should any complain of the tempo adapted by the orchestra…. inform such that you are playing according to the instructions of the floor manager, to whom you pleasantly refer them, adding that you will willingly change it is his wish…..In the case of a new party, or no instructions regarding tempo, watch the effect of the music, and change it if it seems too fast or too slow.
Grand Right and Left: It is well to make this call “Right hand to partner, grand right and left”.
Ladies’ Chain (8 bars): Danced by opposite couples at same time. Opposite ladies cross, give right hand in passing, join left hand with opposite gent, and turn half around. (Before the invention of the courtesy turn — perhaps as a flourish, as suggested recently on this list-serv).
The Voice: Do not strain the voice under any circumstances; the effect is injurious, and will soon render it useless. A few lessons in elocution, for the purpose of learning to throw out the voice, as in singing, will prove money well invested.
Commit to memory one set of figures of a quadrille, for example, and call aloud and with the music until perfectly learned and the calls exactly in time; then take up the next. The first attempts are nervous times at best, so that all calls should be perfectly committed in the order they are to come, leaving nothing to memorandums or books before entering the hall. Practice with the music until the calls are thoroughly mastered on time, and distinct. (This reminds me of a square calling workshop I attended at Augusta in 1990 taught by Larry Edelman, in which we were forbidden to have dance cards in our hands while calling — though we could use them in teaching.)
Figures requiring two calls, such as right and left etc, give the first call on the eighth bar (i.e. counts 15 and 16), the last on the fourth (i.e. counts 7 and 8). Invariably finish calling before the strain begins, otherwise the dancers will be behind, which detracts from their pleasure and the general effect.
``````````````````````````````````````````````````````````
Richard Hopkins
Middlebury, VT
850-544-7614
hopkinsrs(a)comcast.net
