30 Oct
2023
30 Oct
'23
9:50 p.m.
Jeff,
My intention wasn't to start a big "Is Positional better or worse?" thread.
Instead, my goal was to use a simple example of why lumping in Positional
Calling as a generic genderfree role term choice may be another version of
"leaving up the role terms to the caller" - which is the subject of this
thread.
For many organizers, it may only be important to distinguish between
gendered vs non-gendered calling. For other organizers, lumping positional
and Larks/Robins together is still pushing that responsibility from
organizer to performer. There's no "correct" answer, but I don't think
we
can just assume that contrasting different types of genderfree Calling
doesn't belong in this topic.
Best regards,
Julian Blechner
On Mon, Oct 30, 2023, 1:10 PM Jeff Kaufman <jeff(a)alum.swarthmore.edu> wrote:
Meta: this thread is on whether series should avoid
"callers choice"
for roles; can folks who want to get into whether positional calling is a
good idea for contra start a new thread?
Jeff
On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 1:01 PM Julian Blechner via Organizers <
organizers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
For what it's worth, I went to a dance where
a caller chose
role-name-light dances, and had this interaction with my partner, a
college-age dancer who's reasonably experienced. We were just in hands four.
(Small talk ensues, then unprompted:)
Partner: "The second dance I got confused by something the caller said. I
can't remember what exactly."
(Dance had us in Long Lines, for a Larks allemande left.)
Caller: "Left hand dancer with the left hand free ... allemande left"
Partner: "That was it."
(Next move is the same role does something else, again the caller chose
to not just say "larks")
Unless one is censoring one's repertoire severely, even dances with basic
things like "one role allemandes after a long lines" which is in a
bajillion dances, can get so much more wordy. And, if the dance has a few
people need prompting mid-dance, there's no simple way to recover if you're
avoiding saying a role name.
So, I'd suggest any organizer who is considering allowing positional
calling take the time to understand the ramifications to what that actually
means.
In dance,
Julian Blechner
On Mon, Oct 30, 2023, 9:28 AM Rich Dempsey via Organizers <
organizers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
In Rochester, NY, where our policy is
"gender neutral calling", which
includes both positional and larks/robins terminology, I haven't noticed
that any dancer cares about the distinction. The real point for our dancers
is clarity and economy in teaching the dance so we can start the music.
On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 1:20 AM Joe Harrington via Organizers <
organizers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
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How do you feel, in a gender-neutral series,
about leaving the decision
of larks/robins vs. positional to the caller, so long as it's declared and
publicized in advance? At least in some areas, there are not enough
positional callers to have an all-positional series.
Thanks,
--jh--
On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 12:32 AM Lisa Marie Lunt via Organizers <
organizers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
> I think it's important to listen to what Don Veino just wrote. Don is
> both a caller and organizer. It's not fair to put the responsibility for
> choosing role names on the callers. It's the organizers' responsibility to
> make decisions about our dances.
>
> Lisa Lunt
> She/her
> Jamaica Plain (Boston) Gender Free Contra Dance
>
> On Sun, Oct 29, 2023, 4:17 PM Don Veino via Organizers <
> organizers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
>> As a caller and organizer, this is a hot button topic for me. Please,
>> if you are organizing a dance, take responsibility for this decision and
>> make it clearly public to your participants in advance. I understand you
>> may be uncomfortable making this choice and possibly want to "please
>> everybody" by leaving it to the caller but that just sets up the worst
>> dynamic for all.
>>
>> My take is that the dance's organizers *own* the culture and
>> implementation policies of their dance. If you would not leave it up to the
>> caller to decide to do swing dance instead or declare the admission is half
>> off for a given event, then you shouldn't leave such a topic to them either.
>>
>> "Traditional", Larks/ Robins, positional - alternating per event,
>> whatever - make the determination and let the people coming know in advance.
>>
>> I personally will no longer accept bookings from a dance that doesn't
>> have a stated role term policy. I will call with the terms stated (or
>> decline the event). I had a booking for a longstanding dance which changed
>> from decades of "Traditional" to "Caller's Choice" after
booking me, with
>> no heads up. I first heard of it when I started hearing from people
>> advocating for one or the other terms, as "my choice". The organizers
>> wouldn't make the call and the publicity was already out there. Bad scene
>> for all, not the way to set up dance joy.
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 29, 2023, 1:28 PM Sandy Seiler via Organizers <
>> organizers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>> <snip>
>> Currently terminology is the caller's decision. So it goes back and
>> forth from gendered to non gendered. That is not mentioned on the website,
>> but I do know that at least one of our callers has requested that the
>> Lawrence board make a decision about it so the callers don't have that
>> responsibility and possible fall out from it.
>> </snip>
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