9 Sep
2015
9 Sep
'15
8:45 p.m.
Here's a suggestion I don't think I've seen in this discussion. If you want to
call a dance with a shadow swing, how about save it for time when you can have several
shorter sets, and remind couples they can join other sets when they reach the top or the
bottom, to get an opportunity to dance with a bigger variety of people. (And of course
remind dancers they may have the surprise of a new shadow.)
Richard
On Sep 8, 2015, at 11:06 AM, Maia McCormick via Callers wrote:
Hey all,
First, a disclaimer: Some people on this listserv thing shadow swings are problematic.
Some don't see any issue with them. This is NOT the conversation I want to have in
this thread; I ask that you respond to the question I'm asking and do not debate my
premise--at least not in this particular thread. This should help keep this thread on
track and hopefully reduce excess noise and go-nowhere discussions on this listserv.
Thanks!
Anyway, the actual question I wanted to ask (whew!)--
There do exist some really fabulous shadow-swing dances that I would love to be able to
call, as long as I could do so without putting anyone in an uncomfortable position. Do
folks have ideas for ways to mitigate the potential harms of shadow swing dances? I was
considering, at the beginning of the dance, having dancers identify their shadow and
mentioning, "this will be a shadow swing dance, so if you need to make any changes,
do so now" (or something like that)--haven't gotten the wording down-pat, but the
idea is giving dancers advance warning of a shadow swing so they can move (thereby
changing their shadow) if they need to. Any thoughts on this method? Suggestions of
others?
Cheers.
Maia
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9 Sep
9 Sep
9:11 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
I like that. A related tactic is to swap roles with your partner (thereby swapping
shadows). And you get to dance both roles, which makes you a better and more enjoyable
dancer.
-Eric
On Sep 9, 2015, at 1:45 PM, Richard Fischer via Callers
<callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Here's a suggestion I don't think I've
seen in this discussion. If you want to call a dance with a shadow swing, how about save
it for time when you can have several shorter sets, and remind couples they can join other
sets when they reach the top or the bottom, to get an opportunity to dance with a bigger
variety of people. (And of course remind dancers they may have the surprise of a new
shadow.)
Richard
9:16 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
Eric: Not all dancers enjoy dancing or skilled enough to dance both roles. Dancers
should not have to resort to such subterfuge to avoid unpleasantness perpetrated by an
insensitive caller. Michael Fuerst 802 N Broadway Urbana IL 61801 217 239
5844
On Wednesday, September 9, 2015 4:12 PM, Eric Black via Callers
<callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
I like that. A related tactic is to swap roles with your partner (thereby swapping
shadows). And you get to dance both roles, which makes you a better and more enjoyable
dancer.
-Eric
On Sep 9, 2015, at 1:45 PM, Richard Fischer via Callers
<callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Here's a suggestion I don't think I've
seen in this discussion. If you want to call a dance with a shadow swing, how about save
it for time when you can have several shorter sets, and remind couples they can join other
sets when they reach the top or the bottom, to get an opportunity to dance with a bigger
variety of people. (And of course remind dancers they may have the surprise of a new
shadow.)
Richard
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9:13 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
Richard: Your suggestion is subterfuge to rationalize the caller's doing something
(calling a shadow swing dance) that should never be done. Michael Fuerst 802 N
Broadway Urbana IL 61801 217 239 5844
On Wednesday, September 9, 2015 3:45 PM, Richard Fischer via Callers
<callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Here's a suggestion I don't think I've seen in this discussion. If you want
to call a dance with a shadow swing, how about save it for time when you can have several
shorter sets, and remind couples they can join other sets when they reach the top or the
bottom, to get an opportunity to dance with a bigger variety of people. (And of course
remind dancers they may have the surprise of a new shadow.)
Richard
On Sep 8, 2015, at 11:06 AM, Maia McCormick via Callers wrote:
Hey all,
First, a disclaimer: Some people on this listserv thing shadow swings are problematic.
Some don't see any issue with them. This is NOT the conversation I want to have in
this thread; I ask that you respond to the question I'm asking and do not debate my
premise--at least not in this particular thread. This should help keep this thread on
track and hopefully reduce excess noise and go-nowhere discussions on this listserv.
Thanks!
Anyway, the actual question I wanted to ask (whew!)--
There do exist some really fabulous shadow-swing dances that I would love to be able to
call, as long as I could do so without putting anyone in an uncomfortable position. Do
folks have ideas for ways to mitigate the potential harms of shadow swing dances? I was
considering, at the beginning of the dance, having dancers identify their shadow and
mentioning, "this will be a shadow swing dance, so if you need to make any changes,
do so now" (or something like that)--haven't gotten the wording down-pat, but the
idea is giving dancers advance warning of a shadow swing so they can move (thereby
changing their shadow) if they need to. Any thoughts on this method? Suggestions of
others?
Cheers.Maia_______________________________________________
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9:15 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
On 9/9/2015 2:13 PM, Michael Fuerst via Callers wrote:
Richard: Your suggestion is subterfuge to
rationalize the caller's
doing something (calling a shadow swing dance) that should never be done.
Michael Fuerst 802 N Broadway Urbana IL 61801 217 239 5844
Never, Michael? That seems pretty dogmatic.
Kalia
9:20 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
You know, just a few minutes ago Alan posted a very reasonable call for civility on this
list. He specifically mentioned not assuming "that your experiences trump their
experiences." I've seen prominent callers call dances with shadow swings, and
I've seen people enjoy them. Some callers may want to use them, some may not. And if
we're trying to be civil, let's not see the worst in others. ("Your
suggestion is a subterfuge to rationalize...")
Richard
On Sep 9, 2015, at 5:13 PM, Michael Fuerst wrote:
Richard: Your suggestion is subterfuge to
rationalize the caller's doing something (calling a shadow swing dance) that should
never be done.
Michael Fuerst 802 N Broadway Urbana IL 61801 217 239 5844
On Wednesday, September 9, 2015 3:45 PM, Richard Fischer via Callers
<callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Here's a suggestion I don't think I've seen in this discussion. If you want
to call a dance with a shadow swing, how about save it for time when you can have several
shorter sets, and remind couples they can join other sets when they reach the top or the
bottom, to get an opportunity to dance with a bigger variety of people. (And of course
remind dancers they may have the surprise of a new shadow.)
Richard
On Sep 8, 2015, at 11:06 AM, Maia McCormick via Callers wrote:
Hey all,
First, a disclaimer: Some people on this listserv thing shadow swings are problematic.
Some don't see any issue with them. This is NOT the conversation I want to have in
this thread; I ask that you respond to the question I'm asking and do not debate my
premise--at least not in this particular thread. This should help keep this thread on
track and hopefully reduce excess noise and go-nowhere discussions on this listserv.
Thanks!
Anyway, the actual question I wanted to ask (whew!)--
There do exist some really fabulous shadow-swing dances that I would love to be able to
call, as long as I could do so without putting anyone in an uncomfortable position. Do
folks have ideas for ways to mitigate the potential harms of shadow swing dances? I was
considering, at the beginning of the dance, having dancers identify their shadow and
mentioning, "this will be a shadow swing dance, so if you need to make any changes,
do so now" (or something like that)--haven't gotten the wording down-pat, but the
idea is giving dancers advance warning of a shadow swing so they can move (thereby
changing their shadow) if they need to. Any thoughts on this method? Suggestions of
others?
Cheers.
Maia
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
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9:15 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
Richard,
My bad. That was suggested (by Luke D?), as a triplet-esque solution, whereby smaller
sets, run shorter, limited the potential for problems.
If the problem is dancers who are new, or easily confused, short sets can increase the
confusion as you get turned around that much faster, with fewer dancers in the middle to
reinforce the pattern of the dance. If the problem is a very uncomfortable swing or
strong aversion to the shadow, I personally would prefer a long set, but alternate
choreography to the swing, suggested by the caller.
I definitely think that a shadow becomes an anchor, so suggesting line swapping will
remove what, for some, will make a confusing dance doable at all. If I were calling, that
is one thing I wouldn't choose.
Thanks for the new/missing from summary suggestion.
Andrea
Sent from my iOnlypretendtomultitask
On Sep 9, 2015, at 4:45 PM, Richard Fischer via
Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Here's a suggestion I don't think I've seen in this discussion. If you want
to call a dance with a shadow swing, how about save it for time when you can have several
shorter sets, and remind couples they can join other sets when they reach the top or the
bottom, to get an opportunity to dance with a bigger variety of people. (And of course
remind dancers they may have the surprise of a new shadow.)
Richard
On Sep 8, 2015, at 11:06 AM, Maia McCormick via
Callers wrote:
Hey all,
First, a disclaimer: Some people on this listserv thing shadow swings are problematic.
Some don't see any issue with them. This is NOT the conversation I want to have in
this thread; I ask that you respond to the question I'm asking and do not debate my
premise--at least not in this particular thread. This should help keep this thread on
track and hopefully reduce excess noise and go-nowhere discussions on this listserv.
Thanks!
Anyway, the actual question I wanted to ask (whew!)--
There do exist some really fabulous shadow-swing dances that I would love to be able to
call, as long as I could do so without putting anyone in an uncomfortable position. Do
folks have ideas for ways to mitigate the potential harms of shadow swing dances? I was
considering, at the beginning of the dance, having dancers identify their shadow and
mentioning, "this will be a shadow swing dance, so if you need to make any changes,
do so now" (or something like that)--haven't gotten the wording down-pat, but the
idea is giving dancers advance warning of a shadow swing so they can move (thereby
changing their shadow) if they need to. Any thoughts on this method? Suggestions of
others?
Cheers.
Maia
_______________________________________________
Callers mailing list
Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
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9:48 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
Andrea: Alternate choreography to replace a shadow swing is oxymoronic. The composer
invoked the (morally questionable) shadow swing because it fit well into the dance's
flow. If one is disposed to substitute for the shadow swing, one should just discard
the dance, Michael Fuerst 802 N Broadway Urbana IL 61801 217 239 5844
10:03 p.m.
New subject: [Callers] Shadow Swing Disclaimers?
You've never substituted a pass through dosido instead of a dosido pass
through? Or a gypsy/allemande/dosido change if you had too many of one in a
night?
Is it that you think dances written are sacrosanct, or that the shadow
swing is too key to a dance - and is different from more common moves as
I've mentioned?
On Sep 9, 2015 5:49 PM, "Michael Fuerst via Callers" <
callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
Andrea: Alternate choreography to replace a shadow
swing is oxymoronic.
The composer invoked the (morally questionable) shadow swing because it
fit well into the dance's flow. If one is disposed to substitute for the
shadow swing, one should just discard the dance,
Michael Fuerst 802 N Broadway Urbana IL 61801 217 239 5844
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8 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
-
Andrea Nettleton via Callers -
Eric Black via Callers
-
Kalia Kliban via Callers
-
Michael Fuerst via Callers
-
Richard Fischer via Callers
-
Ron Blechner via Callers