On the subject of gypsies and language, I've enjoyed reading the myriad comments, and find myself feeling ambiguous (which I define as feeling very strongly both ways). And, I know it's been thrashed about and we've a request for acknowledging that we are unlikely to change any opinions on this. That said: * I have had this discussion with a number people in the past, about the very strong negative connotations of the word "Gypsy." Ambivalent as I am, I do think we should look for a replacement word. * I thought I'd collect all the words that have been suggested so far (unless I missed one or two) in one place. Here it is: No Hand Turn No Hand Allemande (and I do think Allemande comes from "The German," a dance) Dance Around, or Walk Around Face to Face Do Si Do Bine (binary stars -- snippet below) Nose-to-Nose Do Si Do Dance Around - or Dance About Orbit Around - or Orbit About Loop Eddy Vortex Swirl Spiral Eyes or "Take Eyes" Holding Eyes Eyeballs Facing Maypole Hands Off Face à Face (facey-face...) Right (Left) Shoulder (without the G-word) Cyclone (though mentioned with a complaint - too "violent") * I like "Single File with a Smile" to replace "Indian Style." Many Indians don't like the moniker "Native American," and vice versa -- America is a name that comes from a European explorer, in some ways more insulting than the misconstrued "Indians," from the name given by a murderous European explorer... It is good, I think, to stop using words that come from stereotyped images of an oppressed or victimized people. * When thinking of our positive feelings about the word -- "happy, colorful," think about people of the slave-holding South remembered with great delight how "Nigras" were always happy, and how warm and wonderful it was when they were slaves. Of course, they rarely considered that that "happiness" stemmed from fear -- the fear of bodily injury, jail, or even lynching... * We are teaching dance in a public forum. Dog breeders use the word "bitch" regularly -- no problem. Start calling a woman that word, and the connotation is different. A chink in a chain, a dike to hold back water or in a rock formation, etc. are all used in specialized situations. I run into a similar problem as I love playing the Jews Harp... Our use of the word Gypsy in a public forum could be said to have that specialized meaning. But it can be construed to have those negative connotations. * Eric Black says he uses "Gents & Ladies," never, "men & women." Years ago I stopped using Ladies & Gents since their roots are steeped in classism, and we live in a severely class society -- even though we pretend we don't. Be that as it may, I started using Ladies & Gents again when I realized most of us don't have those connotations associated with those words. Now I've gone gender free, and use ravens & larks. But when I was young we used "him," and "he" to mean "everyone. We did notice the affect this had on young women as promoting that sense of exclusion that still dominates our culture. Most of us now say "he and she," or just "she", and it has changed how some of us think about the power of women. Language does make a difference. Much of this came about from discussions on how the words I choose to use affect some. Most of are "unaffected," by the use of certain words. Or at least we don't perceive an affect of the use of certain words. It's like those of us who are White often don't know the scrutiny Black people are subjected to throughout their everyday lives. Or the majority of us men don't live with the fear and degradation women are subjected to. It is important to understand how our language affects those around us, especially from the podium. Well, enough for now, as that's more than two-cents worth... ~erik hoffman oakland, ca The Snippet on from Richard Fischer (richardallenfischer(a)verizon.net) "Bine": "bine" and I derive it from each other as in our dance certain circumstances orbit about each other. mutual thing.) say, and its etymology is It is hard to know when offend anyone, but I know out there. _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net

* I thought I'd collect all the words that have been suggested so far (unless I missed one or two) in one place. Here it is:

No Hand Turn No Hand Allemande (and I do think Allemande comes from "The German," a dance) Dance Around, or Walk Around Face to Face Do Si Do Bine (binary stars -- snippet below) Nose-to-Nose Do Si Do Dance Around - or Dance About Orbit Around - or Orbit About Loop Eddy Vortex Swirl Spiral Eyes or "Take Eyes" Holding Eyes Eyeballs Facing Maypole Hands Off Face à Face (facey-face...) Right (Left) Shoulder (without the G-word) Cyclone (though mentioned with a complaint - too "violent")