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2524 discussions

by Donna Hunt via Callers

Here in Philadelphia the MSW group (Independence Squares) is an LGBT and straight group and we dance to the calls of girl/boy and are free to dance whichever role we wish without any identifying "sashes". Our callers are fantastic at remembering who the couples/boys/girls are during any square. Donna Hunt -----Original Message----- From: Jeremy Child via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> To: Callers <Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> Sent: Tue, Sep 27, 2016 2:47 pm Subject: [Callers] Boys and Girls Hi This is for the MWSD callers amongst you. There has been much discussion on this group about the terms used for the two roles in contra dance. I do not propose to resurrect that here, I mention it to emphasise that many feel the terms used to be important, and that we should be moving away from any gender connotation in them. MWSD uses Ladies, Gents, Men, Women, Girls, Boys - all highly gendered. Is it time we changed these? If so, how? In theory with Callerlab it will be easier, but I suspect they would strongly resist such a change, since the "maleness" and "femaleness" of the roles (e.g. skirt work) is such a fundamental part of what MWSD is. Thoughts? (Apologies to those to whom this is all gibberish) Jeremy Child www.barndancecaller.net www.genderfreedance.net _______________________________________________ Callers mailing list Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net

8 years, 3 months

Re: [Callers] Boys and Girls

by Jeremy Child via Callers

Thanks Rich. Agreed, in the MSWD Community the terms are generally not a problem, but in the same way that in the contra dance community they weren't a problem 20 years ago. What is a problem is that whilst women can dance the boys role, for men to dance the girls role is frowned upon unless the alternative is not enough for a square. I like dancing the girls role as well as the boys, but rarely get to do so. I say it's a problem - but only I seem to see it as one. Everyone else is too busy tutting at me for donning a pink sash and dancing lady. Rather reminiscent of what Contra was like not so many years ago. In the UK we rarely see role-swapping in MWSD. Men hardly ever dance as girls, and women who dance as boys usually do so exclusively. There is little true swapping, whereby a person might dance girl one time and boy the next. It IS generational, but also one of the reasons MWSD is struggling to survive. Change must come if MWSD is to continue, and if we leave it too late, then, well, it will be too late. There will be no community left to carry on the dancing. For all the reasons mentioned, change will be hard, so we need to start sooner rather than later. I also believe the gender norms contribute to the current inability of most MWSD dancer to do moves from anything other than normal positions - something Callerlab *is* concerned about. Perhaps I should lobby Callerlab! Jeremy www.genderfreedance.net On 27 September 2016 at 15:44, Rich Sbardella <richsbardella(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Jeremy, > > Perhaps this is a partially generational concern. > > In the MWSD community today, there is much role swapping among dancers. > Most often ladies are dancing the gents' role. The terms boys and girls, > are roles much like ladies and gents in the contra scene. Although I call > fewer MWSD events these days, in 25 years have never encountered > opposition, or even concern about these terms at a MWSD event. Many out > dated gender specific terms are used in the activity as well, for example, > lads and lassies, and ruffles and beaus. All these terms are part of their > dance "tradition". > > The MWSD community is generally much older, and does not have problems > with these traditional dance terms. As noted the terms are often selected > to fit within the rhythm and rhyme of patter. As a caller who calls to > both MWSD and contra communities, I am trying very hard to eliminate boys > and girls, and it is very hard. It is like speaking a new language > language, and having no time to think about what comes next. It all > happens so fast. > > As most of the MWSD community ages out, perhaps gender terms will become a > concern, but I do not see that happening any time soon. > > Rich Sbardella > Stafford, CT > > > > > On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 7:26 PM, Angela DeCarlis via Callers < > callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: > >> I imagine that the conversation must be much more complex in MWSD given >> the tradition of patter. As I understand it, oftentimes the decision of >> which term to label each role is determined by what might best rhyme with >> the following call, or by how many syllables you have time to say. >> >> While it's probably a much more ambitious endeavor -- and one which I'm >> sure as a contra dance caller I have very little grasp of -- I would say >> that many MWSD communities are ready to handle a role-term change, but that >> it would take exceedingly creative and experienced callers within that >> tradition to help determine what those might look like. >> >> Good luck! >> Angela >> >> On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Jeremy Child via Callers < >> callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: >> >>> Hi >>> >>> This is for the MWSD callers amongst you. >>> >>> There has been much discussion on this group about the terms used for >>> the two roles in contra dance. I do not propose to resurrect that here, I >>> mention it to emphasise that many feel the terms used to be important, and >>> that we should be moving away from any gender connotation in them. >>> >>> MWSD uses Ladies, Gents, Men, Women, Girls, Boys - all highly gendered. >>> Is it time we changed these? If so, how? In theory with Callerlab it will >>> be easier, but I suspect they would strongly resist such a change, since >>> the "maleness" and "femaleness" of the roles (e.g. skirt work) is such a >>> fundamental part of what MWSD is. >>> >>> Thoughts? >>> >>> (Apologies to those to whom this is all gibberish) >>> >>> Jeremy Child >>> www.barndancecaller.net >>> www.genderfreedance.net >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Callers mailing list >>> Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net >>> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Callers mailing list >> Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net >> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net >> >> >

8 years, 3 months

Re: [Callers] Boys and Girls

by Rich Sbardella via Callers

Jeremy, Perhaps this is a partially generational concern. In the MWSD community today, there is much role swapping among dancers. Most often ladies are dancing the gents' role. The terms boys and girls, are roles much like ladies and gents in the contra scene. Although I call fewer MWSD events these days, in 25 years have never encountered opposition, or even concern about these terms at a MWSD event. Many out dated gender specific terms are used in the activity as well, for example, lads and lassies, and ruffles and beaus. All these terms are part of their dance "tradition". The MWSD community is generally much older, and does not have problems with these traditional dance terms. As noted the terms are often selected to fit within the rhythm and rhyme of patter. As a caller who calls to both MWSD and contra communities, I am trying very hard to eliminate boys and girls, and it is very hard. It is like speaking a new language language, and having no time to think about what comes next. It all happens so fast. As most of the MWSD community ages out, perhaps gender terms will become a concern, but I do not see that happening any time soon. Rich Sbardella Stafford, CT On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 7:26 PM, Angela DeCarlis via Callers < callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: > I imagine that the conversation must be much more complex in MWSD given > the tradition of patter. As I understand it, oftentimes the decision of > which term to label each role is determined by what might best rhyme with > the following call, or by how many syllables you have time to say. > > While it's probably a much more ambitious endeavor -- and one which I'm > sure as a contra dance caller I have very little grasp of -- I would say > that many MWSD communities are ready to handle a role-term change, but that > it would take exceedingly creative and experienced callers within that > tradition to help determine what those might look like. > > Good luck! > Angela > > On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Jeremy Child via Callers < > callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: > >> Hi >> >> This is for the MWSD callers amongst you. >> >> There has been much discussion on this group about the terms used for the >> two roles in contra dance. I do not propose to resurrect that here, I >> mention it to emphasise that many feel the terms used to be important, and >> that we should be moving away from any gender connotation in them. >> >> MWSD uses Ladies, Gents, Men, Women, Girls, Boys - all highly gendered. >> Is it time we changed these? If so, how? In theory with Callerlab it will >> be easier, but I suspect they would strongly resist such a change, since >> the "maleness" and "femaleness" of the roles (e.g. skirt work) is such a >> fundamental part of what MWSD is. >> >> Thoughts? >> >> (Apologies to those to whom this is all gibberish) >> >> Jeremy Child >> www.barndancecaller.net >> www.genderfreedance.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Callers mailing list >> Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net >> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Callers mailing list > Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net > >

8 years, 3 months

Re: [Callers] Yet another "Anyone seen this dance?"

by Winston, Alan P. via Callers

The Barraclough and Goldman experiences with the dance already have belied my suspicion, but what I was thinking was that the extremely common use of "circle left 3/4 and swing on the side" was going to interfere with "Circle left all the way and swing on the side", and that we might see a failure mode of going three places and swinging partner there. Reality has already proven me wrong. -- A;an On 9/26/2016 5:38 PM, Yoyo Zhou wrote: > On Sat, Sep 24, 2016 at 4:34 PM, Alan Winston via Callers > <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net > <mailto:callers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote: > > If you call it tonight, I suspect some dancers will have some > trouble with the circle left all the way around the second and > subsequent times through. > > But let us know how it goes! > > I think circle left all the way around (rather than 3/4) is not > inherently difficult for contra dancers. > > Circle lefts that are hard: > > - Circle left 1/2. It's so easy to just keep circling. > > - Ending with gents ahead of ladies on the side. (e.g. N swing; *then* > circle left 1) > This is because almost all of our circles end with ladies ahead of > gents on the side (to set up for a swing, or a pass thru/CA twirl > progression), so we're very used to ending our circle lefts with > ladies in 1st corner and gents in 2nd corner places. > > Yoyo Zhou >

8 years, 3 months

[Callers] Yet another "Anyone seen this dance?"

by Ric Goldman - Letsdance via Callers

Hi folks, I was thinking about dances for tonites gig and this sequence came together in my heard. I figure someone mustve come up with it before me. Anyone recognize it? A1 Circle L 1x Nbr swing, end facing down A2 Down hall, turn alone Come back, bend line B1 Balance ring, petronella Ptnr swing B2 Circle L ¾ Balance ring, California Twirl Thanx, Ric Goldman

8 years, 3 months

Re: [Callers] Boys and Girls

by Angela DeCarlis via Callers

I imagine that the conversation must be much more complex in MWSD given the tradition of patter. As I understand it, oftentimes the decision of which term to label each role is determined by what might best rhyme with the following call, or by how many syllables you have time to say. While it's probably a much more ambitious endeavor -- and one which I'm sure as a contra dance caller I have very little grasp of -- I would say that many MWSD communities are ready to handle a role-term change, but that it would take exceedingly creative and experienced callers within that tradition to help determine what those might look like. Good luck! Angela On Mon, Sep 26, 2016 at 7:19 PM, Jeremy Child via Callers < callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: > Hi > > This is for the MWSD callers amongst you. > > There has been much discussion on this group about the terms used for the > two roles in contra dance. I do not propose to resurrect that here, I > mention it to emphasise that many feel the terms used to be important, and > that we should be moving away from any gender connotation in them. > > MWSD uses Ladies, Gents, Men, Women, Girls, Boys - all highly gendered. > Is it time we changed these? If so, how? In theory with Callerlab it will > be easier, but I suspect they would strongly resist such a change, since > the "maleness" and "femaleness" of the roles (e.g. skirt work) is such a > fundamental part of what MWSD is. > > Thoughts? > > (Apologies to those to whom this is all gibberish) > > Jeremy Child > www.barndancecaller.net > www.genderfreedance.net > > _______________________________________________ > Callers mailing list > Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net > >

8 years, 3 months

[Callers] Boys and Girls

by Jeremy Child via Callers

Hi This is for the MWSD callers amongst you. There has been much discussion on this group about the terms used for the two roles in contra dance. I do not propose to resurrect that here, I mention it to emphasise that many feel the terms used to be important, and that we should be moving away from any gender connotation in them. MWSD uses Ladies, Gents, Men, Women, Girls, Boys - all highly gendered. Is it time we changed these? If so, how? In theory with Callerlab it will be easier, but I suspect they would strongly resist such a change, since the "maleness" and "femaleness" of the roles (e.g. skirt work) is such a fundamental part of what MWSD is. Thoughts? (Apologies to those to whom this is all gibberish) Jeremy Child www.barndancecaller.net www.genderfreedance.net

8 years, 3 months

[Callers] new (?) dance - with a shadow swing

by Luke Donforth via Callers

Hello all, I know the list has had big debates about shadow swings in the past. If you don't like 'em, you can pitch this. This dance was written for someone who wanted a shadow swing, and is something I might call at a shadow-themed festival session. As shadow swings go, I like the idea of swingus interuptus going from shadow to partner. To my knowledge, it's a new composition. Haven't gotten to test it yet. But I present it for comment and/or collection. Becket, cw A1 Circle L 3/4 Neighbor Swing A2 Promenade across with neighbor Left Diagonal Ladies chain (to shadow) B1 women start 1/2 hey straight across by Right shoulder Women Do Si Do 1x B2 Shadow swing Partner swing (no slide required, circle with couple straight across)

8 years, 3 months

Re: [Callers] Dance Variety

by via Callers

Rich, I avoid many of the pit falls by not calling an "all modern" program (though I do not know to what venue, dance crowd you call for.) I like to mix in older unequal dances, Proper, Chestnuts, Classics Shadracks Delight Chorus Jig Nantucket Sleighride Becket Reel to name a few. (Lately I have become bored with dances that feel the same, Partner swing, Neighbor Swing, Chain, Hay) Check out some of the older tried and trues, You may be surprised! Gale Wood

8 years, 3 months

[Callers] Fwd: dance caller desperately needed, please! - Vermont, Oct 8

by Ron Blechner via Callers

Forwarding with permission, since I am unavailable that weekend - any caller available and interested in southwest VT dance - sounds like a barn dance, family-friendly, etc - can reach out directly to Cynthia Larson, email included below. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Cynthia Larson" <cynthial(a)myfairpoint.net> Date: Sep 19, 2016 1:54 PM Subject: dance caller desperately needed, please! ... our annual family-style contra/ square dance on Sat, Oct 8. We have 2 musicians, but could flex if you have your own. Our usual caller is out of town that day! We roast a steer, make cider, and have a charity auction that day on the farm. Please let me know if this is possible, and if not, please give me ideas! We pay our musicians. We usually dance from 7-10. > We are in Wells, VT, SW Rutland county. > Thank You! > Cynthia Larson > www.larsonfarmvt.com

8 years, 3 months

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