Just out of curiosity, since I had a gig scheduled while this discussion
was going on, I tried substituting the phrase "right/left shoulders
around" for "gypsy." I had not taught the move in the beginners
session. The first dance this came up in had a neighbors gypsy 1-1/2.
I said "neighbors right shoulders around once and a half," the dancers
all did it, easy peasy. It's not too hard to remember to substitute the
term, and will get easier as it goes along.
I called 2 dances today, the Sebastopol English dance and the Petaluma
contra. I had a few "gypsy halfway" moments at the English but no full
gypsies. Several at the contra and I found the different terminology to
cause not the tiniest ripple on the floor. It was seamless.
Kalia
We’ve had very few opinions, other than heresay, about gipsies in the UK. I have never heard the term gipsy used as a pejorative for Romany gipsies, in fact their national body is called the Gipsy Council.
www.gipsy-association.co.uk
John Meechan
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: Ron Blechner via Callers
Sent: 01 November 2015 19:38
To: Tom Hinds
Cc: callers
Subject: Re: [Callers] Gypsy / "Redneck"
"who on this list believe that contra dancers have a negative view of the Romani people because of the word gypsy?"
Over the last few days, as this conversation has spilled out onto a few forms of social media, I have now heard specific stories about people who are Roma and/or have Roma heritage who are folk dancers in dance forms that use "gypsy" as a term, and are offended directly.
As to your question, do you consider "negative" to include "reinforcing stereotypes"? Maybe?
What if we had a dance move called "redneck". Sure, there's plenty of find country folks in America who proudly self-describe as a "redneck". There are songs written about them. There are people who dress up for Halloween as them. etc. Does that mean that there aren't also plenty of people who have been called "redneck" as a slur against the stereotype of "dumb, rural, ignorant yokels"? I find the parallels compelling enough where I'm now seriously leaning off the fence...
-Ron Blechner
On Sat, Oct 31, 2015 at 10:37 AM, Tom Hinds via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
In my opinion the offended women actually helped spread a stereotype she didn't like. Who on this list knew that Romani women had a reputation for being (I can't remember, was it) sexual? Not me. Okay, it was the caller she complained to who put it out there, but she started it. Should the caller feel defensive or should the caller turn the issue around if it's appropriate?
I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY WANT TO KNOW, who on this list believe that contra dancers have a negative view of the Romani people because of the word gypsy? Anyone?
For me the more important issue is education. I learned another tidbit about the Romani people. Yes I understand how people can be sensitive, but perhaps this woman needs to learn something about us before jumping to conclusions.
Tom
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Here is is one people have a lot of fun with and it's a scatter set that has a gypsy (which you can debate replacing with one of the many discussed alternatives.)
Accretion Reel by Chris Page
(I'm very loose about numbers in a group. )
Groups of four (or 5 or 6 or whatever)
A1 balance the ring of four and scatter (balance in, out, in, kaboom)
A2 catch someone's eye, gypsy/gyre and swing
B1 promenade and find another couple ( or two or three)
B2 circle left, circle right
Leslie Gotfrit
When this discussion started I decided to actually use honky instead
of gypsy the next time I called. I would of course explain to the
dancers this extremely important and delicate issue that is now
confronting the contra dance community. Why not get a chuckle from
the floor? I appreciate the suggestion of red neck but I think honky
flows better. See the end of this email for calling examples.
Several people have thanked me off list for what I said because they
don't want to be seen as insensitive. Basically we think there's way
too much mental effort and concern based on 1 person's complaint.
That I'm actually taking time at all on this topic is a bad
reflection on my judgment.
Ron, I really want to know: since you started dancing have you
thought badly of the Romani people because of the use of the word
gypsy? Is there any caller or dancer out there who has thought badly
about Romani people because of this call?
At the time that I wrote my last email, I also wrote the following
but decided not to send it because I didn't want to be seen as
insensitive. Here it is. Maybe you'll get a chuckle.
As a caller I've often used self-defecating humor to get dancers to
relax. It shows that we callers are human and can make mistakes
etc. It also takes the focus off of them and on to me.
With that said I was thinking that we, the white majority in the US,
might consider pointing the finger at ourselves in a joking way.
This might show minorities that we to can take a joke and perhaps
communicate that, in some situations, it's important not to take
things too seriously.
Let's do away with the call gypsy and replace it with honky. Here
are some examples:
"Honky your partner"
or
"Honky 'round your neighbor"
or
"ladies honky once and a half"
If a Romani person ever complains to you tell them this: naming a
move after an ethnic group is one of the highest honors of our dance
community. The only other people to be so honored are the Dosidoes.
Tom
Hi Janet,
I agree entirely re "gypsy"!
But, please, not "Homo Sapien"!
"Homo Sapiens" is the singular. The "s" on the end does not
indicate plural. You can't take it off to make it singular.
The plural is "Homines Sapientes".
It hurts when I hear someone say it without the "s". :-(
Happy dancing,
John
John Sweeney, Dancer, England john(a)modernjive.com 01233 625 362
http://www.contrafusion.co.uk for Dancing in Kent
Brief Encounters for 5 couples longways proper. A total hoot. On Nov 1, 2015 8:12 AM, Donna Hunt via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
> Thanks everyone for great ideas.
> It was late when I posted my request and I should mention that this is an English/Contra crossover weekend (Princeton Country Dancers Head for the Hills).
>
> I'm definitely looking for dances that don't fit a genre and appeal to contra dancers (ie swings and not too much inactivity). Am open to "barn" dances if there's something unusual (but not too much sashaying).
>
>
>
> Donna
> Web Site: donnahuntcaller.com
> Email: dhuntdancer(a)aol.com
> Cell: 215-565-6050
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bree Kalb <bree(a)mindspring.com>
> To: Donna Hunt <dhuntdancer(a)aol.com>; callers <callers(a)sharedweight.net>
> Sent: Sun, Nov 1, 2015 7:18 am
> Subject: Re: [Callers] dances in unusual formations
>
> Levi Jackson Rag is a favorite of mine but not all bands know the tune.
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Donna Hunt via Callers
>> Sent: Nov 1, 2015 12:10 AM
>> To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
>> Subject: [Callers] dances in unusual formations
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi
>> I'm doing a workshop on dances "outside the box" (ie, no squares or contras).
>> Anyone have any interesting dances for contra dancers that fit the criteria?
>>
In the season premiere of the U.S. tv show "Black-ish,” in an episode that tackles who can use what racial slurs, “negro” comes up and causes offense to Black characters. The following exchange occurs, between the protagonist’s consistently racist boss and the protagonist:
“Well, in that case, maybe I should put a stop payment on the half-million dollar check that I just wrote to the United Negro College Fund.”
“Come on, Mr. Stevens, be honest—you only wrote that check so you can say ‘Negro.’”
“Well, I definitely don’t do it so I _can’t_ say it.”
Read Weaver
Jamaica Plain, MA
http://lcfd.org
> On Nov 1, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Jeff Kaufman via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
> On Nov 1, 2015 3:30 PM, "John Meechan via Callers" <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net <mailto:callers@lists.sharedweight.net>> wrote:
> >
> > I have never heard the term gipsy used as a pejorative for Romany gipsies, in fact their national body is called the Gipsy Council.
> >
>
> That might just mean it's an old organization. In the US the NAACP is a big national organization which stands for "national association for the advancement of colored people" but "colored people" is definitely not OK to use anymore.
>
Jacob Bloom mentioned this dance:
> Borrowdale Exchange - Scatter mixer
> Formation: three couples in circle
>
> Circle left, Circle right
> Forward and Back, partner dosido
> Hands-across right hand star. Starting with the two people whose hands are lowest, each pair pulls their partner to them for a swing
> Promenade with your new partner to make new sets
I've also seen something similar where dancers mix only
within their group of three couples (eventually getting
original partners back) and throughout the whole hall.
You can see a version called by Phil Jamison (under the
name "Pull the Lady Through") here:
http://squaredancehistory.org/items/show/301
(also at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm5KTs-yTI8 )
And here's an archived message where I described (as best I
remembered it) a version I danced to the calling of Dolores
Heagy:
http://lists.sharedweight.net/pipermail/callers-sharedweight.net/2014-March…
Jacob also mentioned:
> Billingsdale Pattern - Chip Hendrickson
> Two couples in line, women back to back
>
> Hey for four
> Dosido partner, Swing
> Right hand star, Left hand star
> Ladies Allemande R once and a half, Allemande L Neighbor. Start with Ladies back to back first two times, Gents back to back second two times.
On page 81 of _Zesty Contras_, Larry Jennings describes both
"Billingsdale Pattern" and his own variant of it, titled
"Chippendal Ornament".)
--Jim
I've found You Married My Daughter But Yet You Didn't to be a good
alternative tune for Levi Jackson Rag.
Jacob
On Sun, Nov 1, 2015 at 7:17 AM, Bree Kalb via Callers <
callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
> Levi Jackson Rag is a favorite of mine but not all bands know the tune.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Donna Hunt via Callers
> Sent: Nov 1, 2015 12:10 AM
> To: callers(a)sharedweight.net
> Subject: [Callers] dances in unusual formations
>
>
>
> Hi
> I'm doing a workshop on dances "outside the box" (ie, no squares or
> contras).
> Anyone have any interesting dances for contra dancers that fit the
> criteria?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>
>
"who on this list believe that contra dancers have a negative view of the
Romani people because of the word gypsy?"
Over the last few days, as this conversation has spilled out onto a few
forms of social media, I have now heard specific stories about people who
are Roma and/or have Roma heritage who are folk dancers in dance forms that
use "gypsy" as a term, and are offended directly.
As to your question, do you consider "negative" to include "reinforcing
stereotypes"? Maybe?
What if we had a dance move called "redneck". Sure, there's plenty of find
country folks in America who proudly self-describe as a "redneck". There
are songs written about them. There are people who dress up for Halloween
as them. etc. Does that mean that there aren't also plenty of people who
have been called "redneck" as a slur against the stereotype of "dumb,
rural, ignorant yokels"? I find the parallels compelling enough where I'm
now seriously leaning off the fence...
-Ron Blechner
On Sat, Oct 31, 2015 at 10:37 AM, Tom Hinds via Callers <
callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
> In my opinion the offended women actually helped spread a stereotype she
> didn't like. Who on this list knew that Romani women had a reputation for
> being (I can't remember, was it) sexual? Not me. Okay, it was the caller
> she complained to who put it out there, but she started it. Should the
> caller feel defensive or should the caller turn the issue around if it's
> appropriate?
>
> I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY WANT TO KNOW, who on this list believe that
> contra dancers have a negative view of the Romani people because of the
> word gypsy? Anyone?
>
> For me the more important issue is education. I learned another tidbit
> about the Romani people. Yes I understand how people can be sensitive, but
> perhaps this woman needs to learn something about us before jumping to
> conclusions.
>
> Tom
>
> _______________________________________________
> Callers mailing list
> Callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net
> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>
