On Apr 6, 2018, at 3:49 PM, Yoyo Zhou via Callers <callers(a)lists.sharedweight.net> wrote: That would have been from me in a message to this list on July 9, 2014 with the subject "An observation about end effects -- becoming neutral three times at each end". https://www.mail-archive.com/callers@lists.sharedweight.net/msg07945.html Based on the meager response at the time, I fear that few readers got my point (though it looks like Yoyo was one who did). For the TL;DR crowd, here's the short version: In almost every contra with even a simple out-of-minor-set action, dancers who reach the top or bottom will become neutral and return to the body of the set not twice but at least *THREE* different times. I'm not going to give an example. I think that anyone who picks a few examples of dances with out-of-minor-set action and actually takes the trouble to trace the end effects carefully will see, now that I've pointed it out, that what I've said is true. And anyone who won't take that trouble to do that probably also wouldn't take the trouble to study my analysis of an example if I gave one. In case anyone's wondering about my terminology, I won't try to give definitions of "out-of-minor-set action" and "neutral" that cover every unusual situation, but here are some remarks about common situations that should make my meaning clear: If you leave your partner to dance with a shadow and then return to your partner, or if you leave a neighbor to dance with a future neighbor or a previous neighbor and then return to the first neighbor, I count that as an out-of-minor-set action. If a dance merely has you and your partner progress to new neighbors in the middle of the tune (instead of at the transition from B2 to A1), and you stay in that new foursome until the same point in the next round of the dance, then I don't count it as out-of-minor-set action. I also don't count merely taking hands in long lines with a shadow or a past or future neighbor while you still have your partner or your current neighbor in the other hand. If dancers are doing something in groups of four, I count any dancers near the top or bottom to the set who aren't part of a complete foursome as neutral. This includes the case where a pair dancers stand still during a diagonal ladies' chain or a diagonal right and left through because there's nobody to do it with. If most of the dancers are doing a two-person figure with partners, neighbors, or shadows on the sides of the set, then I count as neutral any dancers at the top or bottom who are (1) standing still, (2) "dancing with ghosts", or (3) dancing the figure with someone *across* the set (possibly a partner or shadow acting as a neighbor). --Jim

On Apr 11, 2018, at 5:18 AM, Tom Hinds <twhinds(a)earthlink.net> wrote: I didn't give an explicit example in my 2014 message https://www.mail-archive.com/callers@lists.sharedweight.net/msg07945.html but I did go into more detail about the general pattern than in my recent posting. And I fear that as a result some people glanced at my message, decided it was too long, and didn't read it. (TL;DR = "too long; didn't read".) In our current thread, Yoyo pointed out that "The Hobbit" is an example, and he identified the three different points where neutral dancers reenter the set. A simpler example is "Lisa's Contra", mentioned earlier in this thread by Mark Hillegonds. Here, with a little reformatting, is how Mark notated it: Lisa’s Contra by Tom Hinds Contra/Improper/Int A1 ----------- (16) Neighbor B & S A2 ----------- (4,4) Pass thru to a wave, Wave balance (2,4,2) Walk forward to person in next wave (don't take hands), Gypsy R 1/2, Walk back to re-form original wave, but facing opposite direction (N in RH, Gents LH) B1 ----------- (4,4) Wave balance, Gents alle L 1/2 (8) Partner swing B2 ----------- (6,2) Circle L 3/4, Pass thru up and down (8) Next Neighbor do si do [For Tom's original notation and notes, see page 15 of his book _Bad Hair Decade_.] This dance includes just one out-of-minor-set action: In the A2 part, you briefly leave your current neighbors to gypsy (or "walk around" or whatever you want to call it) with your previous neighbor. The result is that when you get to the top or bottom of the line, you experience THREE pairs of transitions out and back in, as follows: * In B2 of some round of the dance, you pass through up or down and the here's no new neighbor to dance with. [So this is the first time you go out.] * In A2 of the next round, you briefly come back in [for the first time] to g**** your previous neighbor. * Then you immediately go back out [for the second time]. * In B2, a new neighbor approaches and you come in [2nd time] starting with the do-si-do. * In A2 of the next round, you step forward from your wave and there's no old neighbor coming toward you along the line. [You've just gone out for the third time.] You could dance around a "ghost" or you could treat your partner (across the set) as a neighbor. * Then you return to a new wave with the neighbors you just briefly left. [That's the third time you come back in. You now remain in until you get to the other end of the set or the music stops.] I could give other examples, but really all you need to do is pick almost any dance where you go out of your minor set (to dance with a previous neighbor, future neighbor, or shadow) and then return. If you analyze the end effects carefully, you'll usually find that dancers go out (become neutral) and come back in at least three times. It's actually harder to find examples where they go out and come back in exactly twice. Often, the thing to do in order to come back in in the right position is so obvious to experienced contra dancers that we hardly notice there's a decision to be made. We just do the obvious/habitual thing and it turns out to be right. I think that's part of the reason that the commonness of the (out-in)x3 pattern could go unnoticed for so long by so many people. I don't know of anyone who wrote about it before I noticed it in 2013 (if anyone does, please tell me). And by then I must have experienced it myself hundreds of times, if not a thousand or more in 30+ years of dancing, without really noticing. --Jim