A description of how to capture the actual originator (not just the list) sent to Dave off-list.

Thanx, Ric

From: Callers [mailto:callers-bounces@lists.sharedweight.net] On Behalf Of Dave Casserly via Callers
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 6:54 AM
To: Caller's discussion list <callers@sharedweight.net>
Subject: Re: [Callers] here it is - sorry

I also don't want to read any more of Michael's replies, particularly on this issue (but also on others: see the comparing shadow swings to groping, etc).  Several people have asked him to stop, but he won't.  But I don't think "this list isn't working" just because some of us think one person is rude.

Maybe others disagree, and find his comments helpful.  Great!  To each their own.  But I can't figure out a way to block receiving his emails without also blocking quite a bit of other traffic on this list.  Has anybody else been able to do so?  Moderators, would this be a feature that could be added?

On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 9:43 AM, Ron Blechner via Callers <callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

I'm really tired of personal attacks here on Shared Weight, and a high percentage comes from one person.

I've asked Michael Fuerst to not contact me again. I've already cut down my usage, but if we can't trade ideas without having them called "bizarre" and "absurd", then this list isn't working.

On Apr 4, 2016 1:56 AM, "Michael Fuerst" <mjerryfuerst@yahoo.com> wrote:

Ron:

"we're comparing our having fun traveling to various dances to the widespread persecution of an ethnicity (the worst being the Holocaust)."

Maybe you do.   No one else uses such  bizarre logic.  

Conbtradancers as a group are about as left of center  and non-discriminatory in their beliefs as any non-political group gets.

Your suggestion is absurd

Michael Fuerst      802 N Broadway      Urbana IL 61801      217 239 5844

On Sunday, April 3, 2016 8:38 PM, Ron Blechner <contraron@gmail.com> wrote:

That article had a few interesting *new* points, for me.

1. That Roma are in the US, not just Europe, and face continued discrimination.
2. That Roma in the US often don't speak up about their identity out of fear of discrimination.
3. That perhaps the use of "gypsy" as a term isn't as bad as non-Roma self-identitying as "dance gypsies". Roma wander because they are persecuted or can't find work. When we talk about "dance gypsies" beig wandering from place to place, we're comparing our having fun traveling to various dances to the widespread persecution of an ethnicity (the worst being the Holocaust).

On Apr 1, 2016 10:03 AM, "via Callers" <callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

I was thinking that very thing, but didn't have any experiences.  Something I read recently pointed out that Romani people in Spain proudly refer to themselves as "Gitano" which translates to Gypsy. 

This is issue is not as cut and dry as many of us would like it to be.

Thanks for sharing this story.

******************************************************************************************************
Amy Carroll
amy@calleramy.com
206-330-7408
http://www.calleramy.com/

On April 1, 2016 at 9:02 AM Rich Sbardella <richsbardella@gmail.com> wrote:

There are still at least two sides to this argument.  Although I am using the term less and less, I want to relate a recent experience.

I was dancing in one of MA biggest contra venues as a caller walked the a dance with a "two eyed" turn.  A dancer in my line became more than a little upset, yelling it "it's a gypsy".  Turns out the dancer is Romani, and the term "gypsy" is one he proudly owns. 

I do not think the Roma people as a whole have come to a consensus.   (For example, The Gypsy Kings proudly use the term as a reference to their heritage.)

Rich Stafford

On Fri, Apr 1, 2016 at 4:56 AM, Michael Fuerst via Callers <callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

Ms Carroll:

Quite frankly a fairly useless article for us.    

Ms Raessi is "a Romani/Métis researcher and activist" so it seems logical that she dislikes the term gypsy.

She  lists alleged myths stereotypes about Romani people

Every ethnic group has an associated set of  myths and stereotypes.    

Every ethnic group tries to purge the negative stereotypes and retain the positive aspects of their heritage.

Ms Raessi writes "many people find that using this term is wrong because it perpetuates misinformation about our origins"

This makes little sense.     Anyone person bigoted enough to entertain any of her alleged stereotypes has no idea about the origins of Romani people.

Ms Raessi writes  "...the term has been used as a racial slur and is loaded with stereotypes ..."

Yes the word gypsy has been used to deprecate Romani people but over the years it evolved  to mean a free-spirited or nomadic person.

Other ethnic slurs (such as kike, chink, jap or nigger) have not similarly evolved, and thus their use remains offensive. 

This article discusses some  English words or idioms that evolved from ethnic slurs:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/24/offensive-words-_n_4144472.html

The ongoing discussion during the past year of the word gypsy has included claims that some persons of  Romani descent embrace gypsy and its positive aspects of current usage,  most don't care, and some hate the word.   And of course only those who object will speak out.   

As long the common usage of  gypsy keeps evolving towards a free-spirited or nomadic person, keeping it in the contra lexicon seems appropriate

Michael Fuerst      802 N Broadway      Urbana IL 61801      217 239 584

On Thursday, March 31, 2016 11:32 PM, via Callers <callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

http://bellydanceu.net/culture/520/

"What's wrong with the Word 'Gypsy'?"

******************************************************************************************************
Amy Carroll
amy@calleramy.com
206-330-7408
http://www.calleramy.com/

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