Luke --

This isn't directly responsive to your actual question, but here's what it reminded me of:

In proper duple formation, the place where same-sex neighbors would stand in improper formation is diagonally opposite.  Most longways English dances are proper, so in English for these purposes, English "first corners" = contra "ladies", English second corners = contra gents.

In "News From Tripoli", first corners cast up or down the outside (pulling the shoulder back, a real cast)  while their same-side neighbors slide (just move sideways along the line) into the places they've vacated, then do a full figure eight and finish in their neighbors place.  (Now second corner people are standing in first corner places, and they repet the figure doing what the first corner people did; everybody's at home.)

In Barbarini's Tambourine (and Sally in Our Alley, which has the same A parts), first corners cast around neighbor on the side, half figure eight, and finish in each other's place.  Second corners cast around (it's their partner, but standing next to them on the side), half figure eight, finish in each other's place.

In some 1700s dances as reconstructed, in a duple minor proper formation, 1s half -figure eight to the right (gents down, ladies up) to go through the 2s next to them; those 1s encounter the opposite-role 1 from the next set up (it's not quite a shadow interaction since while you do see the same person for a while, it stops happening when one of you goes out at the end of the set), so it's effectively long diagonals.

In a number of dances (Kelsterne Gardens may be the earliest, although some like to do it in Childgrove, which is an earlier dance) there are double figure eights, where one couple is is crossing through the middle while the other couple is going up or down the outside.  In fewer dances, there are double half figure eights; one couple goes through the middle, the other on the outside.  So you don't need the diagonal half-figure to not have to worry about them running into each other.

I would add to Michael's mention of Chevrons that a lot of people have trouble waiting one bar to start their part of the figure, and it does raise the difficulty level of the dance.

There's an "all cast one place" in "Wa is Me, Wa Mun I Do", which takes two bars of triple time music and a fair amount of room but is very pretty in context.  I think your "gents pull left should back and cast" has some of the logistical problems of an orbit (it's a quarter orbit) as far as using space, with increased chance of collision with gent from other set because of not facing the way you're going for the first half.  Slide across, orbit 1/4 while making a point of interlacing with other gent, or lots of room in the set.

-- Alan

Hello all,

I've been thinking about half figure eights, and variations on them. Is anyone familiar (in ECD, contra, or other traditions), where instead of the 1s or 2s half figure eight, having the gents or ladies do the move from improper formation?

As soon as you have something like the ladies do a half figure eight from duple improper; they're either going to have to shift where they land, or the gents are going to have to get out of the way. It seems to me (during my insomnia, not with actual dancers in a house party) that you could have the gents cast off and over to a ladies place. i.e.:

Ladies half figure eight, passing left shoulder in the middle to take neighbor gents' place

Meanwhile, gents cast over left shoulder to take partner's place

Which takes

(head of hall)

W1 M1

m2 w2

to

(head of hall)

M1 W1

w2 m2

Which ends in the same place as everybody doing a half figure eight, but without 4 people trying to go through the middle at the same time. I think it can still happen in 8 beats of music, with nobody standing around.

Is that a sequence people have danced or used?

Here's a wrapping to put the whole thing in context.

Calliope's Cross

Improper contra by Luke Donforth

A1

Long lines forward and back

Ladies half figure eight, passing left shoulder in the middle to take neighbor gents' place

Meanwhile, gents cast over left shoulder to take partner's place

A2

Neighbor Right Shoulder Gyre and Swing

B1

Circle Left 3/4

Partner Swing

B2

Promenade across set with partner, courtesy turn

Ladies chain to neighbor

The name, and idea, comes from my older daughter (4), who wanted a "Calliope's Cross" dance for herself after hearing about "Tamlin's Cross" for her sister. Calliope like riding figure 8s on her bicycle.

I've deliberately kept this simple, instead of trying to get a gents figure 8 while ladies cast in for symmetry. I'm not sure how I'd teach that from the stage; and think I'd have to use a demo.

I look forward to hearing the experience of the group!

Thanks

--

Luke Donforth
Luke.Donforth@gmail.com

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