[Organizers] Organizers Digest, Vol 29, Issue 5
Greg Allan via Organizers
organizers at lists.sharedweight.net
Tue Mar 7 15:22:02 PST 2017
Indeed, someone who's resistant to being helped is certainly a problem.
Which means David' suggestion would be to ask him how he feels about that.
Ask him if he wants help or not.
And if he doesn't, maybe work up a few three-person alternative figures :P
Greg
On Tue, Mar 7, 2017 at 5:59 AM, via Organizers <
organizers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
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> 1. Re: What to do with a really bad new dancer?
> (Paul Pindris via Organizers)
> 2. Re: What to do with a really bad new dancer?
> (David Kirchner via Organizers)
> 3. Re: What to do with a really bad new dancer?
> (Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2017 21:31:29 -0500
> From: Paul Pindris via Organizers <organizers at lists.sharedweight.net>
> To: Marie-Mich?le Fournier <mariemichele.fournier at gmail.com>
> Cc: Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers
> <organizers at lists.sharedweight.net>
> Subject: Re: [Organizers] What to do with a really bad new dancer?
> Message-ID:
> <CAFwDPfgBcaq6xxX5Ob_hxQb=a2ChfMJGwYNWJ2WrxyVJpHM60A at mail.
> gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I am quite astonished -- actually, troubled -- that anyone would have the
> insensitivity to refer to another dancer as a "speed bump." I am proud to
> relate that I have yet to see any physically challenged dancer at the
> several monthly contra dances in my area of southern New Hampshire be
> anything less than totally accepted as part of our community. Whether
> dancers have had difficulty because of a medical condition, the
> after-effects of a car accident, or simply the problem of "two left feet,"
> they have in every case that I am aware of been made to feel as comfortable
> as possible. The adage I share with every new dancer I cross paths with is
> that contra dancers are three things -- welcoming, helpful, and forgiving.
> In New Hampshire that applies to everyone, and I have yet to encounter any
> exceptions.
>
> Paul Pindris
> Deerfield, NH
>
> On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 2:31 PM, Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers <
> organizers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> > Lately a new dancer has started coming to our dance and he is bad
> > enough that he will often make the set break if the dance is moderately
> > challenging. He seems to have some kind of impairment and walks very
> > stiffly which means he will often not be on time for a figure and also
> > often does not remember what is coming next.
> > We want to be inclusive but at the same time his presence negatively
> > impacts other dancers in his set and while some of the experienced
> dancers
> > will take one for the team and dance with him, it is an unpleasant
> > experience to be his partner. Unfortunately, we always have many new
> > dancers and having one couple not be where they should be can really
> throw
> > them off in some dances so I feel like I have to push and pull him around
> > to be on time, despite the fact that it's a little rude.
> > A recent caller to our dance called him a "speed bump" which was quite
> > accurate. I'm sure other dances have had experience with similar
> troubles,
> > does anyone have advice on how to deal with this so that other dancers
> > still have a good time yet we are nice to this problematic dancer?
> > Thank you
> > Marie
> > ContraMontreal
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Organizers mailing list
> > Organizers at lists.sharedweight.net
> > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/organizers-sharedweight.net
> >
> >
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> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2017 23:19:28 -0600
> From: David Kirchner via Organizers
> <organizers at lists.sharedweight.net>
> To: Marie-Mich?le Fournier <mariemichele.fournier at gmail.com>
> Cc: Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers
> <organizers at lists.sharedweight.net>
> Subject: Re: [Organizers] What to do with a really bad new dancer?
> Message-ID:
> <CACj4M6XPH6_CBMh6smUZLbCM6=rLD5hqzp1x4GGeTV1GFaSd3w at mail.
> gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Marie,
>
> I've read your note very carefully several times. It seems as if there's
> something here that you may not be telling us. You say that "it is an
> unpleasant experience" to partner this dancer. However, experienced dancers
> dance with unskilled newer dancers all the time. And I suspect that in your
> community, as in ours, there are some excellent dancers who pride
> themselves on being good partners to newcomers and helping them become
> acclimated to the dance. I've also seen dancers over the years acclimate
> themselves to dancing with people who have a number of physical or mental
> impairments. So I am guessing that there's something about this dancer
> beyond the physical impairment that makes him an unpleasant partner. Maybe
> one approach would be to try to address that, whatever it is, so that
> instead of having an unpleasant dancer with an impairment, you have a
> pleasant (or at least unobjectionable) dancer with an impairment.
>
> David
> St. Paul, MN
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 1:31 PM, Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers <
> organizers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> > Lately a new dancer has started coming to our dance and he is bad
> > enough that he will often make the set break if the dance is moderately
> > challenging. He seems to have some kind of impairment and walks very
> > stiffly which means he will often not be on time for a figure and also
> > often does not remember what is coming next.
> > We want to be inclusive but at the same time his presence negatively
> > impacts other dancers in his set and while some of the experienced
> dancers
> > will take one for the team and dance with him, it is an unpleasant
> > experience to be his partner. Unfortunately, we always have many new
> > dancers and having one couple not be where they should be can really
> throw
> > them off in some dances so I feel like I have to push and pull him around
> > to be on time, despite the fact that it's a little rude.
> > A recent caller to our dance called him a "speed bump" which was quite
> > accurate. I'm sure other dances have had experience with similar
> troubles,
> > does anyone have advice on how to deal with this so that other dancers
> > still have a good time yet we are nice to this problematic dancer?
> > Thank you
> > Marie
> > ContraMontreal
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Organizers mailing list
> > Organizers at lists.sharedweight.net
> > http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/organizers-sharedweight.net
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2017 06:59:23 -0500
> From: Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers
> <organizers at lists.sharedweight.net>
> To: David Kirchner <dekirchner at gmail.com>
> Cc: Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers
> <organizers at lists.sharedweight.net>
> Subject: Re: [Organizers] What to do with a really bad new dancer?
> Message-ID:
> <CADbbneZm55Gfx9BO4_nGGubz_e-+unyBvcQufDE6g+WKe_4kxQ at mail.
> gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> You are right David, I did not do a very good job of explaining the
> problem. He is both confused and slow, which I had previously encountered
> mostly separately. But he also seem to resist being led to where he needs
> to be, often trying to go somewhere else instead and I don't think he
> realizes that he is not doing well and being disruptive to other dancers.
> And the bad smell makes everything worse.
>
> On any given night our crowd is about half brand-new or beginners and most
> of the beginners we get are fairly young, so we are more used to young
> confused dancers, who seem to be easier to lead around. We also don't have
> enough experienced dancers to cover him all the time unless he accepts
> dancing with men and often times when he dances with other beginners the
> set falls appart or comes very close to it.
>
> But we do want to be welcoming, which is why I'm asking the question. I am
> still trying to figure out how to gently let him know that he is causing
> problems so he'll let us help him and whether we should concentrate our
> efforts to dance with him early in the night or later on.
>
> Thank you everyone for your input so far!
> Marie
>
> On Tue, Mar 7, 2017 at 12:19 AM, David Kirchner <dekirchner at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Marie,
> >
> > I've read your note very carefully several times. It seems as if there's
> > something here that you may not be telling us. You say that "it is an
> > unpleasant experience" to partner this dancer. However, experienced
> dancers
> > dance with unskilled newer dancers all the time. And I suspect that in
> your
> > community, as in ours, there are some excellent dancers who pride
> > themselves on being good partners to newcomers and helping them become
> > acclimated to the dance. I've also seen dancers over the years acclimate
> > themselves to dancing with people who have a number of physical or mental
> > impairments. So I am guessing that there's something about this dancer
> > beyond the physical impairment that makes him an unpleasant partner.
> Maybe
> > one approach would be to try to address that, whatever it is, so that
> > instead of having an unpleasant dancer with an impairment, you have a
> > pleasant (or at least unobjectionable) dancer with an impairment.
> >
> > David
> > St. Paul, MN
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 1:31 PM, Marie-Mich?le Fournier via Organizers <
> > organizers at lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi everyone,
> >> Lately a new dancer has started coming to our dance and he is bad
> >> enough that he will often make the set break if the dance is moderately
> >> challenging. He seems to have some kind of impairment and walks very
> >> stiffly which means he will often not be on time for a figure and also
> >> often does not remember what is coming next.
> >> We want to be inclusive but at the same time his presence negatively
> >> impacts other dancers in his set and while some of the experienced
> dancers
> >> will take one for the team and dance with him, it is an unpleasant
> >> experience to be his partner. Unfortunately, we always have many new
> >> dancers and having one couple not be where they should be can really
> throw
> >> them off in some dances so I feel like I have to push and pull him
> around
> >> to be on time, despite the fact that it's a little rude.
> >> A recent caller to our dance called him a "speed bump" which was
> quite
> >> accurate. I'm sure other dances have had experience with similar
> troubles,
> >> does anyone have advice on how to deal with this so that other dancers
> >> still have a good time yet we are nice to this problematic dancer?
> >> Thank you
> >> Marie
> >> ContraMontreal
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Organizers mailing list
> >> Organizers at lists.sharedweight.net
> >> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/organizers-sharedweight.net
> >>
> >>
> >
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> End of Organizers Digest, Vol 29, Issue 5
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